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 Post subject: (Higher Order) Nomenclature Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 5:34 pm 
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Alright...I don't know about you but the nomenclature used to name higher-order puzzles can be really confusing. It seems to be that the generally accepted term for puzzles with 2 layers is "junior", for 4 layers is "Master", for 5-layer puzzles it is "Professor", etc.
However, this doesn't always seem to hold. For example a 3-layer near deep-cut dodecahedron is called a Master Pentultimate, despite the fact that it has only 3 layers per axis rather than four. Even other wilder examples include the Master Brillic or Master Starminx, which have 5 layers per axis. :?:
I really think there needs to be a consensus as to what names should be given to puzzles of a specific order.
If the base puzzle consists of 3 layers, like a 3x3x3 for example, this naming system seems to be accepted:
2 layers=junior
3 layers=normal (doesn't need a name)
4 layers=master
5 layers=professor
6 layers=royal

However, for puzzles where the base puzzle has 2 layers, this naming system seems to hold:
3 layers=master
4 layers=elite
5 layers=royal
6 layers=imperial

My question is...what should the accepted names be for even higher-order puzzles, such as ones with 7, or up to 11 layers? And in which category? Also, what about those weird exceptions?

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 Post subject: Re: (Higher Order) Nomenclature Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 5:50 pm 
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7- emperor (like Timur's emperor pyraminx)
8- hyper
9- galaxy
10- (insert base puzzle name here) 2nd magnitude
11- universe
BTW, I am just making these up, but that would be pretty cool if they were used. I will use the from now on, though, unless something definite comes around.

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 Post subject: Re: (Higher Order) Nomenclature Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 11:14 pm 
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My perception of the naming convention was that the original puzzle was n. n-1 is a junior, n+1 is a master, n+2 is a professor, etc.

It doesn't have as much to do with Order but with the relationship between origin and current puzzle.

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 Post subject: Re: (Higher Order) Nomenclature Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:26 am 
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There are inconsistencies in the "master" term. Sometimes it means "four layers" as in the 4x4x4 and Master Pyraminx but sometimes it means "just shallow of deep-cut".

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 Post subject: Re: (Higher Order) Nomenclature Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 4:40 pm 
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It seems fairly consistent that the Order+1 of what is viewed as the base puzzle of a series is called master, though it does raise the question as to why so many not quite deep-cut puzzles are considered the +1 variant of the deep-cut puzzle of the same axis system.

That said, the Megaminx family seem to be the only family of puzzles with universally agreed upon names for the really high order members.

Then again, at a point, it becomes easier to just give puzzles a numerical name rather than try to come up with names. For example, I like how Hexaphobic, octophobic, etc. have ousted whatever nomencleture previously existed for tetrahedral shapemods of cubes and that V-cubes simple use the number of layers per axis instead of some fairly arbitrary sequence of adjectives.

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 Post subject: Re: (Higher Order) Nomenclature Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 6:26 pm 
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Jeffery Mewtamer wrote:
It seems fairly consistent that the Order+1 of what is viewed as the base puzzle of a series is called master, though it does raise the question as to why so many not quite deep-cut puzzles are considered the +1 variant of the deep-cut puzzle of the same axis system.
It's a total mess. Why isn't a Master Cube (4x4x4) actually the 5x5x5 because that's what you'd get if you added a shallow cut to each face of a 3x3x3. Instead a deep cut was added to make a 4x4x4.

Before you think this isn't a fair example, is a "Master Megaminx" a Gigaminx? Or is it Gelatinbrain's 1.1.8?

How about the Master Pyraminx Crystal. Why isn't that a Pentultimate + Pyraminx Crystal rather than a Megamix + Pyraminx Crystal.

We (the community) should accept the names designers give to puzzles but not try to extract logic from those names and apply that logic other puzzles. The logic has been inconsistent between names sharing common roots like "Master".

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 Post subject: Re: (Higher Order) Nomenclature Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 9:15 am 
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^Good questions.

From a layperson's perspective, its probably more intuitive to add an extra cut to each face-face axis of the cube than to add a shallow cut to each face of the cube, hence why both even and odd cubes are viewed as a single family rather than Odd cubes being viewed as one family and even cubes as hybrids between an odd cube and the deep-cut face turning cube. Then again, Face turning cubes are kind of unique in that all shallow cut face-turning cubes with one cut per face are mathematical equvalent(i.e. you could make the slice layer 9/10ths the width of the cube or 1/10th of the width of the cube, or anything in between, and it would still behave the same in a 3*3*3).

As for the Megaminx>Gigaminx>Teraminx, etc, I would say its a natural progression, especially since all cuts are equavelent(I.e., removing all but one layer of cuts from the Teraminx, whether the outermost cuts, the innermost cuts, of the middle cuts, would leave behind a puzzle that solves like a Megaminx). Good thing the Megaminx and Gigaminx set a precedent for using a sequence of already well established terms it will take a long time I think before we run out of SI prefixes. I hate to think what kind of nomencleture mess we would be in if the Supernova name had won out over Megaminx(we might be calling the Gigaminx the Hypernova, but there is no standard term for "past hyper" that I know of).

As for the Pyraminx Crystal, I would personal argue for there being no natural/intuitive/whatever way of making a higher order version as any added cuts hybridizes it either with a distinct face-turning dodecahedrong or an in-between form(for that matter, has any name been given to the FTD inbetween Megaminx and Crystal or inbetween Crystal and Starminx? the inbetween Starminx and Pentultimate is well established as the Master pentultimate due to precedent set by the master skewb, but these other two inbetween FTDs seem largely ignored).

Still, I think the bottomline here is that the nomencleture is a mess.

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