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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 5:57 pm

Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:08 pm
Has any one been able to solve the Crazy Tetrahedron Plus? I'm stuck on the Mercury version.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Aug 19, 2011 6:48 pm

Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 5:06 pm
Location: Berkeley, CA, USA
Crazy56U wrote:
Has any one been able to solve the Crazy Tetrahedron Plus? I'm stuck on the Mercury version.

Here's my strategy:

1. Solve the inner edge pieces, intuitively.
2. Solve the outer edge pieces, turning only the type-0 faces.
3. Check the outer corners, if need a 3-cycle to solve, twist the face to fix it and then re-solve the inner and outer edges.
4. Key step: solve the inner corners. I have a 3-cycle algorithm for it, affecting the outer corners.
5. Permute the outer corners.
6. Orient the outer corners.

If you need specific algorithms, pls let me know and I'll figure out some notations to write them down.

_________________
Check out some virtual puzzles I created at http://nan.ma

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:59 am

Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:07 am
Location: Germany, Bavaria
Crazy56U wrote:
Has any one been able to solve the Crazy Tetrahedron Plus? I'm stuck on the Mercury version.
I use a reduction method:
1. solve the inner edges intuitively.
2. pair the outer edges with the corresponding triangles
3. place the (now complete edges) orange outer edges by turning the 0 (non orange) faces only
4. check the corners and do a simple twist of a 0 face, if necessary, and reconstruct the orange face
5. do the other outer edges
6. orientate the corners (which can affect the inner edges representing the centre orientation) as on a Skewb Ultimate

_________________

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 3:52 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hello Friends,

The Witeden Super 3x3x3

Yesterday my Super 3x3x3 and Crazy Megaminx Earth/Uranus arrived ( in the customs office *lol*).

The Super 3x3x3 is much more difficult than the Super 3x3x4 I think.

1ļ¼Restore the shape of Cube
2:Restore the middle layer
3:Restore Crazy 2x3x3 Cube

I can't solve it in this way. The super 3x3x3 is very different to the Crazy 2x3x3.

Most differences:
decision which center turns depends to one corner at 2x3x3.
On 2x3x3 its possible to turn middle layer 90 degrees and then the upper layer 180 degrees.

I solved the cube. I am not sure that it is repeatable.
I saw some videos.
The video from Burgo helped me.
Thanks for the nice video, Burgo.

1. place edges
2. orient corners ( complete the down layer)
In this part I use Burgos sequence ( Sune right Sune left)

To place edges I use a edge only cycle from Fridich 3x3x3 method.
R U' R U R U R U' R' U' R2 ( and the reverse)
To permute 3 corners / edges I use domino/ 3x3x4 methods.
Corners:
R2 U R2 U R2 U2 R2 U2
F2 U' F2 U' F2 U2 F2 U2
Edges:
R2 U' R2 U R2 U2 R2 U2
R2 U R2 U' R2 U2 R2 U2

For the middle layer I use conjugators with sequences above and permute 3 edges.

To flip 2 edges in upper layer it's possible to permute it twice with conjugators.
The problem ist , that the solution steps must partially take parallel.

Cheers, Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 11:14 pm

Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 5:06 pm
Location: Berkeley, CA, USA
schuma wrote:
My ranking from easiest to the hardest:

Earth - Saturn - Venus - Mercury - Jupiter - Mars - Neptune - 0012 - Uranus

Upon rline's request, let me expand on the reasons of my ranking. The ranking depends on the strategy. So if your method is different from mine, you may have a different ranking.

[Spoiler Alert] I'll have to talk about my strategy a little bit from now on.

The simplest case is of course the Jing's pyraminx without any circle, code 2222, or 1111 (or 1222, 1122, 1112, all the same).

The second simplest case is 0000, the "plain" circle tetrahedron.

I rank Earth (0222) to be the next one because although the puzzle has circles which divide the white edges into inner and outer edges, the inner and outer edges are always paired up. Similarly the inner and outer corners are also paired up always. Just scramble the puzzle and you can see this property. The only constraint is that the type-0 face is not allowed to move until the end. So this puzzle is essentially nothing but solving a Jing's pyraminx using only three faces rather than four faces.

Saturn (2110) and Venus (2210) are the next two. They are close to each other. In these two puzzles, I first pair up some corners and solve like Earth. The amount of work during pairing is tyipically pretty small. So they are not much harder than Earth. When I think about them today I think Venus is actually little easier than Saturn.

The above three cicle puzzles are below the common level of crazy circle puzzles. If you have the Crazy 3x3x3 puzzles, I think all the above three tetrahedra are easier than all of the Crazy cubes.

Then we have the classic duo, Mercury(0001) and Jupiter(0111). For them you need some serious algorithms. Between these two, which one is simpler depends on your method (reduction or type-by-type) but I believe they are roughly in the same order.

Mars is 0011. It's natural to see Mars is in between Mercury 0001 and Jupiter 0111. One can basically apply the method for Mercury and Jupiter to Mars. It has just more constraints than Mercury and Jupiter.

I think Mercury, Jupiter and Mars are in the same level of difficulty as the Crazy 3x3x3's.

The next one is Neptune 0022. The inner edges are really annoying. I hate them. The pieces from type-0 faces and the pieces from the type-2 are deeply mixed together. You'll find many stuck faces. Fortunately you have two faces that are always movable. Using these two faces one can rotate the corners. So you'll never get really stuck by the corners.

Then it's the unnamed puzzle 0012. I use the same method as for Neptune. But it's just more things to worry about. It really took me several days to get the first step done -- inner edges.

I think these two puzzles are harder than the Crazy 3x3x3's. The reason is that there's no type-2 faces in Crazy 3x3x3. The theme for Neptune and 0012 is: don't get stuck.

Finally we have Uranus 0002. Out of four faces, only one is guaranteed to be movable. Some algorithms from previous puzzles require two always-movable faces and they are not applicable here. Actually none of my previous algorithms works here. I needed to find a set of completely new algorithms for this particular puzzle. Save this for the last.

_________________
Check out some virtual puzzles I created at http://nan.ma

Last edited by schuma on Thu Aug 25, 2011 2:44 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 12:43 am

Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 5:06 pm
Location: Berkeley, CA, USA
Hi all "crazy" guys, I just updated Bo Hu's simulators to include the new variations, including all variations of circle octahedra, the circle Dayan Gem III, and even the circleless Bermuda cubes. Here's a link for the latest downloadable package. It should work on those computers where the previous version worked

_________________
Check out some virtual puzzles I created at http://nan.ma

Last edited by schuma on Thu Aug 25, 2011 2:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 1:51 am

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:54 am
schuma

Thanks heaps for that explanation. It's incredibly helpful and exactly the kind of thing I was after. I hope others also find it useful.

_________________
Blogger Twisty Puzzling - Simple Solutions for Puzzling Twisties
Tutorials: Pitcher Octo-Star Cube | GERANIUM | Wheel of Wisdom

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:43 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hello,
Who solved the crazy Megaminx Earth ?

I think it's very difficult.

My first try, pair corners with triangles ( like earth cube)

For all 5 faces around the white i need more than 3 hours.
Attachment:

megaearth.jpg [ 68.59 KiB | Viewed 6244 times ]

The duration to get this is more than 3 hours. x ā

perhaps this is the wrong way. My second try wil be solve it like mercury-cube ( pairing edges with triangles)

How do you solve this dodecahedron ? Some Tips ?

Cheers, Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 5:27 pm

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:54 am
Andrea

I have the earth and uranus. I haven't been brave enough to scramble my earth yet, but I just played around with earth doing a few familiar commutators. I discovered that the circle corner alg I use on the earth cube doesn't do a 3-cycle. It looks like a 5-cycle maybe but I don't know. So I've just had nightmares about solving this one circle corners last. So, I echo Andrea's question and have a couple of my own to add

* Would I be "crazy" (no pun intended) to try and solve these crazy megaminxes circle corners last? Do I need to use reduction?

* Is there somewhere which shows the correct colour specifications for the crazy megaminxes? My earth has white/dark blue and grey/light blue as the "0" faces.

* What's the best way to lube these? (It's very hard to turn at present). I have some lubix being posted to me.

Thanks

_________________
Blogger Twisty Puzzling - Simple Solutions for Puzzling Twisties
Tutorials: Pitcher Octo-Star Cube | GERANIUM | Wheel of Wisdom

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 6:16 pm

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
rline wrote:
Would I be "crazy" (no pun intended) to try and solve these crazy megaminxes circle corners last? Do I need to use reduction?

If my solving doesn't work, then I will try (reduction too):
1 ) First solve stars ( inner and outer edges)
2 ) solve circle-edges (triangles) like mercury cube method
3 ) solve the rest

rline wrote:
* What's the best way to lube these? (It's very hard to turn at present). I have some lubix being posted to me.

I used silicone-spray.

My solving state after more hours is:
solved all faces without 2 adjacent (1) faces.
From 1 (the left) of this faces the edges are solved.

This is the solving - method from Crazy Cube Earth.

Attachment:

nextstep.jpg [ 51.68 KiB | Viewed 6220 times ]

Cheers, Andrea

PS: The Crazy Megaminx Saturn is easier, I solved the Saturn in ~ 1 hour.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2011 6:52 pm

Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 7:28 pm
rline wrote:
* What's the best way to lube these? (It's very hard to turn at present). I have some lubix being posted to me.

Hi rline,

For each of the faces I remove the center and apply a drop of Lubix behind one of the center edge pieces and then another drop between the screw sleeve and the inside edge of the puzzle. Then I scramble up and solve the puzzle. The puzzles turn much smoother now. Keep in mind the more nonbandaged faces you have, the better the puzzle turns. That's why Jupiter turns the smoothest and Mercury the least.

As for how to solve these puzzles, refer back to one of my earlier posts where I post links to a few YouTube channels, including Burgo's who uses reduction. Burgo has posted his approach for the Saturn megaminx. There are 2 others, SuperAntoniovivaldi who uses corner centers last method and he is working his way through the series. TheMichaelCha is another who has posted several puzzles and he has an interesting twist, after solving the inner, outer and corner centers, he places and rotates the outer corner pieces.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:28 am

Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:07 am
Location: Germany, Bavaria
Hi Andrea,

I have solved Megaminx Earth using CCL (cycle corners last)
1. stars including outer edges
2. corners
3. cycle corners (little triangles)

It is long and tedious this way, you'll probably not like it.
On the other hand, you are showing that other methods are not so easy, too.

_________________

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:57 am

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:54 am
@ft38

Thankyou for your lubing instructions. It's just what I needed to kow.

You mention you solve earth using corner circles last. Here's my question. When you first come across a puzzle like this, and you think about finding a 3-cycle for circle corners, how do you go about finding one? For instance, if my understanding of 3-cycles is correct (and feel free ot point out if it's not), we want to do a sequence of moves (X) which leaves a face where the only thing that's changed is 1 little circle corner. Then we move another piece into that position (Y) and undo the first moves (X' Y').

This gives us the X Y X' Y'.

So, how do you go about finding X? Trial and error? Educated guessing? On these crazy puzzles, do you have a way of knowing whether to use "0" or "1" faces? Do you link earth megaminx back to earth cube? (Although I guess this will be strange since earth cube has two "1" faces but earth megaminx has four (two on each side) "0" faces...)

_________________
Blogger Twisty Puzzling - Simple Solutions for Puzzling Twisties
Tutorials: Pitcher Octo-Star Cube | GERANIUM | Wheel of Wisdom

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 2:24 am

Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 3:17 am
Location: Australia
Hi Crazy Puzzlers,

Andrea, I'm actually 1/2 way through a tute for Earth Minx, started last weekend, will finish this weekend. I use reduction although I have solved it CCL. Reduction is much easier and faster. There is a CCL alg a few pages back Rline, we talked about it and I posted it. It is CPS based.

When you are searching for a commutator, you are thinking of what you can `do` and `undo` that will affect the pieces you want to move; that will return the pieces you don't want to move.

I'm not a speed solver Andrea, so this isn't bragging, it's just what you can expect soon, I timed myself (because it was in a car trip) last time and it took me 1 1/2 hrs start to finish. (Using reduction).

Talk soon,
Burgo.

_________________
1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 2:37 am

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2011 4:54 am
Hey Burgo

Quote:
There is a CCL alg a few pages back Rline, we talked about it and I posted it. It is CPS based.

There may well be, but I was specifically asking about *how* he comes up with algs, not for any specific algs. Since making that post, I've found 4 different circle corner 3-cycles but it's purely trial and error.

_________________
Blogger Twisty Puzzling - Simple Solutions for Puzzling Twisties
Tutorials: Pitcher Octo-Star Cube | GERANIUM | Wheel of Wisdom

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 9:13 am

Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:07 am
Location: Germany, Bavaria
rline wrote:
...
So, how do you go about finding X? Trial and error? Educated guessing? On these crazy puzzles, do you have a way of knowing whether to use "0" or "1" faces? Do you link earth megaminx back to earth cube? (Although I guess this will be strange since earth cube has two "1" faces but earth megaminx has four (two on each side) "0" faces...)
My first Crazy Plus had been 3x3x3 Mercury. When I had come to CCL, a corner 3-cycle (CPS) and reversing it, but with a different set of faces was not far fetched. It would have an effect on the cycle corners only
I have experimented a bit with this idea and have found

where 5 faces are involved, but only one of them is a 1 face (white), which is turned only twice in the whole sequence.
The first 8 moves have a limited influence on the cycle corners, the last 8 moves have none at all (Instead of doing X' I have chosen mirror (X)) The result is the shown 3-cycle.

When I solved the Crazy 3x3x3 Earth and later Megaminx Earth, I used the same principle: only one of the 5 faces involved is a 1 face. My setup is having in the upper half of the Minx two 1 faces and four 0 faces, but one 1 face is never touched. So, yes, there is much similarity between my 3x3x3 Earth and my Megaminx Earth CCL.

In general, when searching for new commutators, I'm looking for an X that leaves a larger part of my puzzle untouched and then I look for a Y that changes a liitle bit (preferable 1 piece) of the untouched part.

In this specific case, my X does a limited change which is preserved when I do the X' (actually mirror(X)).
This is not exactly a classical commutator.
ft38 wrote:
... Keep in mind the more nonbandaged faces you have, the better the puzzle turns. That's why Jupiter turns the smoothest and Mercury the least. ....
I have so far seen the term "bandaged" the other way around. A regular circle cube is considered to habe unbandaged faces. 0 face = nonbandaged / unbandaged;
1 Face = bandaged.

_________________

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 10:27 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hello dear Crazy-Cubers,

I give up with this method, but not with the mega-earth.

I can not adapt my cirle-corners permutation from cube to dodecahedron

I tried it with the mega-saturn. Its scrambled now
I dont like sequences with more than 1 move to memorize as setup and undo for conjugators.
make setup moves
make permutation sequence
phone rings ....

begin solution from start.

It's torture to solve 60 cirle-corners with conjugators !
So I looked for reduction methods.

I saw a video on you tube. One man soved the mega-earth.
First stars, then trianges,then corners.
I think this is perhaps a good way.

I don't know any squence that permute corner-circles.

Cheers, Andrea

PS: I love my Mega-Saturn, because I can solve it with reduction.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2011 2:10 pm

Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:07 am
Location: Germany, Bavaria
Hi Andrea,

here is my CC 3-cycle for Earth. The colour scheme is the usual one. I have used Bo Hu's simulator to make the picture.
[I provide a link to a picture
Obviously, you have to change the SlashSlash to //
The first part does involve three 0 faces, after the y' white = 0 face becomes L
The arrows on the result show how the three CC have moved.
Good luck!
]

_________________

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 4:01 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi,

Thanks for your work. I will try this.

Burgo:

I am curious to your meg-earth tutorial. What is CPS ?

I tried Bu Ho's simmulator. It's graphics is nice. Does it accept textual input ?
I programmed a very simple simmulator in C++ with textual input, but it works only for cubes.

Cheers, Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 4:46 am

Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 3:17 am
Location: Australia
Hi Andrea,
CPS=Ultimate Solution's Corner Placement Sequence, EPS=Ultimate Solution's Edge Placement Sequence, CCL=Circle Corners Last, CC=Circle Corners
This is just a quote from pg 4 so nothing new, but:
I went to my notes for my CCL sequence for the Earth Megaminx (converted from the 3x3 Earth commutator):
Make a bandaged face `F` looking directly at you and an `R & L` face and a `RB & LB`face. Make the RB face bandaged also. Perform:
R U2' L' U2
R' U2' L U2
Turn cube y2'
L' U2 R U2'
L U2 R' U2'
Turn cube y2
and you will have exchanged the CCs `U L LB` > `RB U LB` > `RB U R`

The tute I am working on `right now` (waiting for some to load from the camera) is reduction, reducing to a circle cube, it is soo much easier than CCL, it mainly uses EPS, like the Mercury 3x3 .

Cheers,
Burgo

PS I have solved all planet megaminx with reduction, it works for all of them .

_________________
1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 5:46 am

Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 7:28 pm
Hi Burgo,

I am working through the Earth megaminx right now and our approach appears to be the same. It will be interesting to see how you get to the stage where it is reduced to a circle cube. I've entitled my approach the Frankensolve method because as Frankenstein was made of parts from different bodies, my approach involves using many different methods taken from the 3x3x3 regular and crazy cubes. Although maybe not the quickest method, it is simple, fun and challenging. Hopefully you will illustrate it better than I can explain it.

Even though I have been working my way through other puzzles, I keep returning to the crazy puzzle series. I have yet to start the crazy tetrahedron series. Again so many puzzles, so little time. Now if I won the lottery then I could dedicate more time to solving puzzles. Then again I would buy many more puzzles. Yikes!

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 8:53 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hello Burgo,

Burgo wrote:
Make a bandaged face `F` looking directly at you and an `R & L` face and a `RB & LB`face. Make the RB face bandaged also.

I don't understand this explanation.

I have solved the stars now. ( and completed one circle)The Earth has only one orbit for circle-edges. The problem was, if you build faces and can not turn 1 face there are orbits. One Orbit is around the two (1) faces. The connection point of the orbit is the edge between the 2 bandaged faces.
So, I began with the circle-corners around this bandaged faces. So blue and white together is my bottom where I began. I end on grey and lightblue. The last circle-edges are difficult.
The Order is different to the mega-saturn.

I used EPS to solve the outer edges.

Now, I solve the circle-corners like your method from Crazy-Cube Venus and Mercury.
Only for the (1) bandaged faces I must find sequences.
I will try to modify my sequence

( L2 U R2 U' ) x 2 from mercury/venus cube

to the mega-earth.

One circle I completed. If the circles are ready I will try to permute the corners without triangles with unbandaged faces. Last step ist orient the corners.

The Mega-Earth ist the most difficult puzzle that I ever have seen.

Cheers, Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:30 am

Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 3:17 am
Location: Australia
Hi Andrea,
It is for CCL (you don't need it with your reduction method). The first sentence describes how to hold the puzzle (there are 2 ways to position a Megaminx, with an `F face` or with `an edge facing you`) RB=right back face, LB=left back face. Bandaged faces are F and RB, all others in the top half are unbandaged.

Earth is not the hardest one, the hardest are Mars & Neptune .

Cheers,
Burgo.

_________________
1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:56 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Burgo,

Thanks for the explanation.

Quote:
Earth is not the hardest one, the hardest are Mars & Neptune

Hmm.

Ok , I agree that Mars is the most difficult.

With cubes:

easy : jupiter, uranus, NEPTUNE

middle: mercury, venus

difficult: saturn, earth, mars

So, I thought mega-neptune is not so hard.

Cheers, Andrea

ps: (edit)
My circle completation doesn't work. If I add one triangle to a circle, an other triangle disapears.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 4:26 am

Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 3:17 am
Location: Australia
Hello fellow Crazy Town residents,

I tell you what, I hope I get a few Christmas cards for this one.. It was a big effort, I just hope you like it.

Earth Megaminx tutorial:

Plus, I have updated my Mercury tutorial to an improved method last weekend, (thanks Andrea).

Cheers,
Burgo.

_________________
1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)

Last edited by Burgo on Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 6:46 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Dear Burgo,
I hope you get many nice Christmas cards. Your work is excellent.
In your videos your intention is to help other people. The number of viewers does no matter. Some other videos have many clicks but they are only self-representation.

I saw now one and an halfe video. I like that. Please give me time to look all viedeos.

Congratulation and respect to your work.

Greetings, Andrea

PS:
Very important: Don't stop, making videos, please !!!

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:42 am

Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 7:28 pm
Hi Burgo,

I have watched all of the videos. Our approach is pretty much the same up until the cube is reduced which is not surprising since I have been one of your students for some time. Once I have reduced the cube, I then solve it as a circle cube by moving only the bandaged faces . I solve the white face and then use a bandaged face as my down face. Now it does require setup moves and some of my edges do get knocked out, but as long as I only turn bandaged faces, the circles corners which go with each edge piece stay in place. I have used the corner placement series on other crazy megaminx puzzles, so I will try this approach on the Earth megaminx.

Thanks again for making my cubing experience so much more enjoyable. You have a knack for conveying your approach in a clear and concise manner. Keep up the great work. I would not only send you a Christmas card, but some holiday spirits. Just don't drink and cube.

Frank

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 12:21 pm

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Burgo,

I solved my Crazy Megaminx Earth !
Now I will try to solve it in less than 3 hours. Is it possible ?

Thanks for the video.

Cheers,

Andrea

PS:
The next and last is the Crazy Megaminx Uranus

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 2:58 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi ,

Burgo:
[quote"Burgo"]Make a bandaged face `F` looking directly at you and an `R & L` face and a `RB & LB`face. Make the RB face bandaged also. Perform:
R U2' L' U2
R' U2' L U2
Turn cube y2'
L' U2 R U2'
L U2 R' U2'
Turn cube y2and you will have exchanged the CCs `U L LB` > `RB U LB` > `RB U R`
[/quote]

I tried this on a solved Mega Earth. The result was that 3 corners were permuted without its circlecorners .
Perhaps I hold the "cube" in wrong position. Perhaps a photo with letters helps.

Your "trick" to flip one edge temporary and replace its CC is very good for the last CC.

In the last step I use easy permutation and orient it separately. So I must use less setup moves.
I use a corner were 3 adjacent unbandaged faces and easy orientation moves (R L' R' L) *2 U (R' L R L') *2

To permute I use 3 unbandaged faces. By example blue, red, light-yellow
red up, blue leftback , lightyellow rightback
sequence: LB ' U RB U' LB U RB' U' ( only an example) ( all sequences of this
type will permute 3 corners, by example replace the U with U2 and U' with U2')

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:20 am

Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 3:17 am
Location: Australia
Hi Crazy friends,
Thanks for the encouragement, I think I see the videos as more of an extension of the conversation here than anything else. And we all contribute to the conversation. Iāve got a couple of short things:

Cheers,
Burgo.

_________________
1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)

Last edited by Burgo on Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:18 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Burgo,

Burgo wrote:

Thank you for this. Now I understand it.

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:06 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Crazy-Cubers,
does someone solved the Crazy Megaminx Uranus ?

I think it's very easy. I solved it very fast with Corner/Triangle reduction.

The Uranus is easier than the Saturn, I think.

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:19 am

Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 3:17 am
Location: Australia
Hi Andrea,
Yeah, Uranus is fairly easy, only just a bit harder than Jupiter and Mercury. Venus is another easy one.
I don't understand your assessment of Neptune as easy, maybe we have a different method .
I have solved them all and I think Mars is the hardest, it is most like the 3x3 Saturn.
Cheers,
Burgo.

_________________
1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:39 am

Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 6:59 pm
Location: Crestwood, IL
I agree with you on that Burgo. The Neptune Crazy Megaminx should be on the hard list alright-definitely not easy. More difficult than the Earth Megaminx! Yet the Neptune Crazy 3x3 is on the easier side in terms of the cubes just above the Jupitr, Mercury, and Uranus 3x3's I feel.

Last edited by 77mouser on Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:28 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Burgo,

Quote:
I don't understand your assessment of Neptune as easy, maybe we have a different method

Yes.
I said the Neptune-Cube is easy! I looked at the box how the neptune is build.

The principle of Neptune Cube/Megaminx is to build the block of (0) unbandaged faces.

At Mega-Saturn its the same. You build a great block, the isolated (1) face souroundet with (0) faces. I saw your videos. You solved that blocks in an other way as I do it.

My solution for that blocks:

Outer pieces first!
Build outer corners and outer edge.
Then fill in circle corner together with on circle-edge together. (pairwise) This is an easy technique.

Then pair corners with triangles without destroying the block and solve it as rubiks cube / megaminx. Because there is a block the turnable (1) faces makes it easy to solve it as cube/megaminx.

I have no Crazy Megaminx Neptune. I you interested I make a video with this technique for Crazy Cube Neptune and Crazy Megaminx Saturn.

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:08 am

Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 3:17 am
Location: Australia
Hi Andrea,
My Neptune method is written on the 4th post down on page 5 (with some photos). Our approach sounds very similar. The difficult thing is that it is possible to build edges flipped incorrectly (because you can't flip them without 3 adjacent bandaged faces) so you need to continually monitor their orientation while building each one. I am actually coincidentally solving it myself tonight, now spooky.
Cheers,
Burgo.

_________________
1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:50 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Burgo,

The Neptune Cube.
After the block is build and the corners and edges are paired begin the completation of middle layer. There must inserted 3 edges. 3 Faces around a corner are bandaged. U R F are bandaged. The block is back bottom left.
It's possible to insert an edge from 1 direction at the back and left edgeposition. If the direction is wrong, put it in the wrong slot rigth/front and then do (F2 U2) x3.
In the middle slot ( right front) you can insert an edge from 2 directions.
from right by example: U' F' U F U R U' R'. From left: U R U' R' U' F' U F.

In the last layer you can swap 2 adjacent edges with: F R U R' U' F'.
If 2 opposite edges swaped you must repeat the sequence.

It's not necessary to destroy corner/edge pairing to swap/orient edges/corners.
To permute Corners you can use a sequence from domino cube that uses 3 faces around a corner.

It's not bragging, I think the Neptune is easier than Saturn, Earth or Mars.
I solved it easier than Mercury and Venus. Only Jupiter and Uranus is easier.

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 2:42 am

Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 3:17 am
Location: Australia
Hi Andrea,
I think you are talking about cubes not megaminx? 77mouser and myself were talking about the Crazy Megaminx (Neptune). There are not 3 bandaged faces adjacent on the Neptune Megaminx like (there are on the Neptune3x3). This is the difficulty for the Neptune Megaminx (I think). I mean, it's probably not that difficult really, I think `painstaking` would be a better description. A `difficulty ranking`is probably a personal subjective response about the kinds of things we `enjoy` unravelling and monitoring on a puzzle (in some ways).
Cheers,
Burgo.
PS (If you were talking about the Megaminx I would definately like to see how you applied the algos).

_________________
1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 3:23 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Burgo,

I own only Megaminx Saturn, Earth and Uranus.
I thought that is similar on Crazy Megaminx. Ok it's not so.
The Sequences are for the Cubes.

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 5:04 pm

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi, People from Crazy-Village,

Because I made mistakes by pairing edges with triangles I searched for other solutions.
My posting from Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:43 am.

I worked out a solution to pair corners with triangles for Mega Earth.

First I solved the Crazy CUBE Earth with Edge Triangle pairing and then with corner triangle pairing. The solution with corner triangle pairing has taken much less time. This is the method in my video tutorial.

So I thought that it must work for Crazy Megaminx Earth, too.
The way is, solve it without the 2 bandaged faces like in the picture from Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:43 am.

Then pair edges with inner edges. Then bring the corners in the correct order.
Now pair corners with triangles in an adjacent face.

Solve one of the to bandaged faces with blockbuilding.
It's possible to orient the corners in last layer with only turn the 2 bandaged faces. ( Sune like sequences)
Last step is to permute edges with only use 2 bandaged faces.

The sequence is :

R U R' U R' U' RĀ² U' R' U R' U R UĀ²'

(edit) this is a 3 cyclic edge( +inner edge) permutation.

I found this sequence in the internet, its a variation of a "bruno" in lars petrus solving method for rubiks cube.

This is very good sequence because the corners are not changed.
This sequence is usefull for other solving methods for crazy megaminxes, I think.

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:47 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Friends,

I am able to reduce the solving by corner triangle pairing to this:
Attachment:

megall.jpg [ 41.47 KiB | Viewed 5729 times ]

(Crazy Megaminx Earth)

It's equivalent to solve a normaly megaminx with only use 2 faces.

To orient the corners is no problem.
Permute edges I had posted the solution.

The problems are the corners. On Crazy Cubes I use a 3th face.
On megaminx it's possible to permute 3 corners turning only 2 faces.
On cube it's not possible. Mathematicans perhaps can explain it. ( On megaminx each turn causes an even permutation)

Does someone know a sequence on a normal megaminx that permutes 3 corners without destroy the orientation and only use 2 adjacent faces ?
It's possible !
I made combination of "sune" moves on a normaly megaminx and after that 3 corners were permuted.

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 9:57 am

Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2011 4:58 am
Location: Germany
Andrea wrote:
Hi Friends,

I am able to reduce the solving by corner triangle pairing to this:
Attachment:
megall.jpg

(Crazy Megaminx Earth)

It's equivalent to solve a normaly megaminx with only use 2 faces.

Does someone know a sequence on a normal megaminx that permutes 3 corners without destroy the orientation and only use 2 adjacent faces ?
It's possible !
I made combination of "sune" moves on a normaly megaminx and after that 3 corners were permuted.

Cheers,
Andrea

I do it similar on my earth.
I solve the last face like this (I turn upper face and right face, both 1-faces):
blue is top, white is right, yellow front)
1. permute edges: sune (cycles three edges)
2. permute the corners: sune U' U' sune (3-cycle of corners)
3. orient the corners (turn the two right top corners): (R U2 R' U' R U' R') y2 U2 (L' U2' L U L' U L) U2'
That's also a sune thing...
that works quite good, allthough quite enough to turn

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 9:58 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi,
I found the sequence.
It's very long.

It permutes 2 adjacent corners with one opposite corner.
Code:
R  UĀ²' R' U' R  UĀ²' R'
R' U'  R  U' R' UĀ²  R     UĀ²'
R  UĀ²  R' U' R  U'  R'    UĀ²
R' U'  R  U' R' UĀ²  R

This sequence and U and repeat this sequence permutes 3 adjacent corners.

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's Crazy?Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:44 am

Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:52 pm
Only for corners without the account of edges (R - orange, U - grey):

U' R2 U'' R'' U2 R2 U' R'' U2 R2 U'' R''.

Last edited by pytlivyj_1 on Sun Sep 04, 2011 1:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 10:56 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Michael,

Termite wrote:
I do it similar on my earth.
I solve the last face like this (I turn upper face and right face, both 1-faces):
blue is top, white is right, yellow front)
1. permute edges: sune (cycles three edges)
2. permute the corners: sune U' U' sune (3-cycle of corners)
3. orient the corners (turn the two right top corners): (R U2 R' U' R U' R') y2 U2 (L' U2' L U L' U L) U2'
That's also a sune thing...
that works quite good, allthough quite enough to turn

Great solution !

Excellent. Your sequences are shorter and easier. I will use it.
My solvingorder now:

Permute edges with my sequence.

Cheers,
Andrea

PS:
I tried triangle - edge pairing versus triangle corner pairing.
With Cube triangle corner pairing ist faster.
With megaminx it's faster too. I think, edge triangle pairing needs ~1 hour more time than triangle corner pairing. But it's only my subjective opinion.

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 Post subject: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:03 am

Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:52 pm
R - orange, U - grey!
Andrea wrote:
Code:
R  UĀ²' R' U' R  UĀ²' R'
R' U'  R  U' R' UĀ²  R     UĀ²'
R  UĀ²  R' U' R  U'  R'    UĀ²
R' U'  R  U' R' UĀ²  R

Shorter algorithm (!!!):
(R' d R) U'' (R' d' R) U' (R' d R) U'' (R' d' R).

d - turn of all bottom part of a normaly Megaminx.

Last edited by pytlivyj_1 on Sun Sep 04, 2011 1:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:23 am

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi pytlivyj_1,

I tried your sequence. It fails. Your sequence destroys the paired corner with triangles ( circle corner). We discussed here reduction methods. Blocks builded with corners and circle corners.

On a normaly megaminx your sequence works fine.

Cheers,
Andrea

It's only allowed to turn the bandaged faces. I end with the grey. So I can only turn the lightblue and grey face. Your "d" move implies that an other face goes to the right. So it's not usefull.

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 12:14 pm

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi pytlivyj_1,

pytlivyj_1 wrote:
U' R2 U'' R'' U2 R2 U' R'' U2 R2 U'' R''

Thanks. This works fine. Nice sequence.

Cheers,
Andrea

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 2:24 pm

Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2011 4:58 am
Location: Germany
ok, my Earth Megaminx relaxing has an end for some time, the beige center is broken, as you see here:

I hope I can get a replacement for it...

Michael

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 Post subject: Re: How to solve Circle Cubes and Megaminx - e.g. Dayan's CrPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 4:54 pm

Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:37 am
Location: Germany
Hi Michael,
Is the replacing centerpieces reason for it ?
Hmm. I am not sure that I will exchange my megaminxes from Earth/ Uranus to Mars/Neptune since I saw your picture.

I hope for you that you find a replacing centerpiece.
Perhaps you can ask a puzzle manufacturer / distributor here.

Cheers,
Andrea

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