Online since 2002. Over 3300 puzzles, 2600 worldwide members, and 270,000 messages.

TwistyPuzzles.com Forum

It is currently Thu Apr 17, 2014 5:04 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 39 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 8:45 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:54 am
Location: Yorkshire, UK
I've had a rough version of this kicking about for a while. Due to other projects, this has sat on the back burner. I have tidied it up somewhat, although I think you'll agree, more work is still needed:

Attachment:
P1050701.JPG
P1050701.JPG [ 73.93 KiB | Viewed 6996 times ]

Attachment:
P1050694.JPG
P1050694.JPG [ 56.88 KiB | Viewed 6907 times ]

Attachment:
P1050696.JPG
P1050696.JPG [ 56.92 KiB | Viewed 6870 times ]

Attachment:
P1050697.JPG
P1050697.JPG [ 68.89 KiB | Viewed 6853 times ]

Attachment:
P1050699.JPG
P1050699.JPG [ 74.71 KiB | Viewed 6877 times ]


It turns reasonably, but probably needs lubing. I know from the earlier version that the textured surface can get dirty quite easily, so I hope to spray it with clear acrylic to protect the surface.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 8:46 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 07, 2008 6:42 pm
Looks nice
sort of like a cheese but different shape

_________________
~-=Tyler=-~

Fastest Times:3x3x3-37 seconds
Magic: 2.48 seconds(after having it for 2 days)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:02 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 9:36 am
Location: Europe
Wow, a spiral, what a great idea! I like the textured look, too. I think it fits the "organic" shape. I'd love to hear more about how it was designed. Any golden ratios on this one?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:29 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:25 pm
Location: New England
Brilliant idea and design. It could use a little touching up as you mentioned, but WOW. I really like this :mrgreen:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:46 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2008 6:43 pm
Location: right here
Wow, that's really cool! Reminds me of a square-1, or a bandaged 3-layer UFO. Very original.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:27 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2007 7:29 am
Location: UK
Nice one

Have you cast your own mechanism?

_________________
Website


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:35 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:16 pm
Location: Somewhere Else
Oh wow. Just... wow.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:39 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2008 2:39 pm
Location: Marquette, MI, USA
Excellent job! I disagree though, as I think it looks magnificent. I love the idea.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:55 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:05 pm
Location: Fort Meade, MD
Bravo!
I wasn't expecting to wake up to that :D

_________________
you know you missed me.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 11:16 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 29, 2004 7:57 am
Location: Στο Κάστρο του Αγίου Γεωργίου
Very innovative!
And beautiful!
I like puzzles in rainbow colours like the masterball or the triamant.
This one would make a nice addition to my collection.

_________________
...................Image..................
http://cube.helm.lu - http://gallery.helm.lu


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 12:33 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:44 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO
Is it made from a masterball?

_________________
http://www.youtube.com/avenueq14


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 12:36 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 22, 2003 9:11 am
Location: Marin, CA
I that three layers, with widths going from one through seven?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 3:28 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:43 pm
Location: Northern Cambria, PA, USA
:shock: I love this so much. I think I'm seeing a pattern here of me loving puzzles that resemble organic shapes. Really nice job...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 3:29 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2008 6:40 pm
Location: Tennessee
that looks very nice :D

_________________
92% of teens would be dead if Abercrombie & Fitch said it wasn't cool to breathe.
Put this in your signature if you are the 8% who would be laughing.

Personal Bests -single(avg of 12)
3x3-22.21(27.09)
4x4-1:28.18(1:53.49)
5x5-3:23.99(3:55.61)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 4:08 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2001 2:50 am
Location: Nottingham, UK
Fantastic mod!
Was it printed?
Vadim


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 4:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 1:47 am
Location: near Utrecht, Netherlands
Vadim wrote:
Was it printed?


Obviously. You can see the tell-tale FDM artifacts.

_________________
Tom's Shapeways Puzzle Shop - your order from my shop includes free stickers!
Tom's Puzzle Website


Buy my mass produced puzzles at Mefferts:
- 4x4x6 Cuboid for just $38
- Curvy Copter for just $18
- 3x4x5 Cuboid for just $34


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 7:33 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 16, 2000 3:17 pm
Location: Hong Kong
That is lovely and I agree with Georges, it would make a nice addition to my collection :lol:

_________________
Rox's Rambling Blog
Katsmom's Puzzling Videos


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 7:39 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:16 pm
Location: Somewhere Else
Are the angles on the wedges all in an arithmetic progression or are they fudged a bit? It looks to me like in the first picture, the purple-red-orange-yellow part should be able to turn, but if the angles are all just multiples of that of the red piece then this should not be the case.

(Also, how on earth did you come up with a central mechanism that lets you turn from any valid cut?)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 8:31 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:51 am
Location: Malibu, California
Beautiful puzzle!

Jared wrote:
Are the angles on the wedges all in an arithmetic progression or are they fudged a bit? It looks to me like in the first picture, the purple-red-orange-yellow part should be able to turn, but if the angles are all just multiples of that of the red piece then this should not be the case.

Say the red pieces is 1 unit... then the total would be 28. That would make the purple-red-orange-yellow section 13 units instead of 14 like it should be. The orange-yellow-green-blue section also looks like it should be able to turn. It's 14 units, so I guess so. I would assume that either everything isn't a multiple of the red piece or the angles are fudged a bit.

_________________
I am taking a break from the forum. You can reach me by PM if needed.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:18 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2008 6:43 pm
Location: right here
Are you planning to sell these? I would also like to have one in *MY* collection. :)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:21 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:51 am
Location: Malibu, California
Though I know I'll be outbid if this is auctioned, I suppose I'll throw my name into the hat and say this would look great in MY collection.

_________________
I am taking a break from the forum. You can reach me by PM if needed.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 11:22 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:02 pm
It looks excellent! It's so original, I love it

_________________
-Paul "No Relation to Steve" Wozniak


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 1:27 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2005 12:12 pm
Location: NY, USA
It's extremely pretty, but I don't really get how it turns. What's the ratio between the pieces? Since it's not all the same (or even similar) I imagine this would be very hard to solve, on the level of the trickiest bandaged puzzles I know.

_________________
My official times
My youtube
Puzzle Solving Service! - a puzzle that has never been scrambled and solved has been wasted.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 1:41 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 12:31 am
Location: Greece, Australia, Thailand, India, Singapore.
My dad (i.e. Poseidon) is very proud of you making this design!

:)


Pantazis


PS. this puzzle does not use the golden ratio number, but soon some puzzles will! ;)

_________________

Educational R&D, Gravity, 4D Symmetry, Puzzle Ninja, Matrix Mech, Alien Technology.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:08 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2008 9:41 am
Location: Spijkenisse, the Netherlands
the difference in angles must make it really hard to solve. I love the shape. And after taking a closer look I see it has 3 layers, which is also amazing

_________________
Olivér Nagy wrote:
43,252,003,274,489,856,000. Or the full number in Hungarian is:
Negyvenháromtrillió-kétszázötvenkétbilliárd-hárombillió-kétszázhetvennégymiliárd-négyszáznyolcvankilencmillió-nyolcszázötvenhatezer :wink: )


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:45 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:54 am
Location: Yorkshire, UK
I folks, thanks for the nice comments.

Jared wrote:
Are the angles on the wedges all in an arithmetic progression or are they fudged a bit?


Sort of and yes.

I puzzled for weeks over this. I started with the idea of a geometric progression, but it proved impossible (for me at least) to find one with enough 180 degree cut combinations. It then occured to me that the triangle number for 8 was 36, giving 8 pieces in an arithmetic progression with a=d=10 degrees. I knew that the ten degree piece would be small, but 3D printed anyway. The 10 degree pieces indeed turned out to be way too fragile, which was a pity because the combinations of sizes was great. I fudged in the end and added 10 degrees to the 80 degree piece so that the progression is 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 90 degrees. I think it still looks ok to the eye though. Still, having 7 colours fitted nicely with the "rainbow" idea!

Vadim wrote:
Fantastic mod!
Was it printed?
Vadim
[Edit: sorry picked up wrong quote first time round!)

I suspect you meant are these directly printed pieces? They are all actually cast from FDM pieces. 23 separate silicone moulds!

Sorry to disappoint on the mechanism front. It is just a miniturised square-1 type rail mech; only one cut on the middle slice. However, I think it will be a tough one to solve: so many unique combinations. Anyone got any ideas how it might be done?


Last edited by timselkirk on Mon Mar 16, 2009 5:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:57 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:51 am
Location: Malibu, California
As far as a solution, I'm not quite sure if there are even enough ways to scramble it for one to not just be able to memorize the positions. There are only 4 configurations from the solved position that allow you to make a turn through the middle. From there, I can't really tell without having a physical puzzle or sitting down and really thinking about it. Perhaps tomorrow I will try to work out a solution.

_________________
I am taking a break from the forum. You can reach me by PM if needed.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 4:48 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:54 am
Location: Yorkshire, UK
Danny Devitt wrote:
As far as a solution, I'm not quite sure if there are even enough ways to scramble it for one to not just be able to memorize the positions. There are only 4 configurations from the solved position that allow you to make a turn through the middle. From there, I can't really tell without having a physical puzzle or sitting down and really thinking about it. Perhaps tomorrow I will try to work out a solution.


There are a surprisingly large number of ways it can be muddled. It very quickly gets very scrambled and confusing! Remember, each angled piece has another the same size (but opposite rotation) which it can be muddled with. It gets very hard to see how to return pieces "home"!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 4:54 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:51 am
Location: Malibu, California
Well, there are 14 pieces and half are indistinguishable so even if any piece could be made to go in any position, you would have "only" 14!/2=43,589,145,600 positions (I suppose multiply by 2 for the middle layer, but that is trivial). I suspect the number is quite less, but still far more positions than I had originally suspected. I still plan on working on a solution, though.

_________________
I am taking a break from the forum. You can reach me by PM if needed.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 5:16 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 07, 2008 4:28 pm
Location: Utrecht, The Netherlands
It has three layers, it looks like, not two.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 8:23 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:57 pm
Location: Pittsburgh
Does the middle layer twist, though? If it's like a square-1, then solving the middle layer is trivial.

_________________
3x3x3 PB: 00:48.10
"Study gravitation, it's a field with a lot of potential."
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 10:13 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 1:47 am
Location: near Utrecht, Netherlands
timselkirk wrote:
I suspect you meant are these directly printed pieces? They are all actually cast from FDM pieces. 23 separate silicone moulds!


That is disappointing, I thought these were the actual prints and you were still going to smooth them. You should have spent some time on smoothing the masters.

_________________
Tom's Shapeways Puzzle Shop - your order from my shop includes free stickers!
Tom's Puzzle Website


Buy my mass produced puzzles at Mefferts:
- 4x4x6 Cuboid for just $38
- Curvy Copter for just $18
- 3x4x5 Cuboid for just $34


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 10:24 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2009 10:16 pm
Location: Miami, FL
As has been mentioned, I like the rough appearance - it makes it look organic, fitting the design.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 10:42 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:16 pm
Location: Somewhere Else
Would the fragility of a 10-degree piece persist if the puzzle were spherical or cylindrical?

(And about the middle slice - because it doesn't get as complex as the rest of the puzzle, I'd suggest making it a different color - if it didn't clash so much with the shape's theme, that is. If you were to make a non-organic shaped version of the puzzle, a black band around the middle would look very nice IMO.)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 10:54 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:54 am
Location: Yorkshire, UK
TomZ wrote:
That is disappointing, I thought these were the actual prints and you were still going to smooth them. You should have spent some time on smoothing the masters.

I was in two minds as to "do I smooth or not". It would not be a tremendous job to sand the masters and re-cast, and I may do this at some point. However,

(1) Once sanded, masters remain sanded, so I would not be able to created a "textured" version.
(2) I like the idea of an organic shape and an organic texture. This puzzle has a really nice warm feel, not unlike holding a real shell as opposed to a clinical smooth feel of a normal puzzle. (unfortunately the "grain" of the artifacts on the centres does not match the grain on the outer pieces. These need to be reprinted with a matching grain.)

Clearly the comments here indicate opinion is divided!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 11:06 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:54 am
Location: Yorkshire, UK
Jared wrote:
Would the fragility of a 10-degree piece persist if the puzzle were spherical or cylindrical?


Sorry, this must have been posted just before I started the last reply.

The answer is I am not sure, but I think the puzzle would be strong enough. It would allow the internal mech to be larger: that is the main cause of problems. I think a flattened ellipsoid would make a more interesting and pleasing shape than a sphere. The mathematical completenes of 8 pieces with angles in an arithmetic progression would be very nice. However, of course the puzzle would lose alot of difficulty, as the top and bottom pieces would be the same (no spiral to distinguish them. I suppose it could be "bumped").

There are loads of possible variations, and I always find it really difficult picking between them when making a puzzle!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:04 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:16 pm
Location: Somewhere Else
If the puzzle were a cube or cuboid, and the angles for the cuts were chosen just right, then the uniqueness to each piece could be restored due to the angles of the outer edges. (But that might compromise the stability of the 10-degree piece, if you decided to put it back in...)

In any case, do you have any plans to produce any more of this puzzle?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 2:30 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:51 pm
Location: Nottingham, UK
That is one beautiful puzzle - well done.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New Puzzle: Rainbow Nautilus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 9:56 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 22, 2003 9:11 am
Location: Marin, CA
Bandaged puzzles in general tend to be extremely difficult. Maximum difficulty is achieved when there's between 2 and 3 available moves per position. For example, the Unscrambled puzzle is 11 pieces with an expected 2.75 available moves per position. Despite the small number of pieces, it's more like cryptography than a puzzle.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 39 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot], idreamincubes, rakaCN and 10 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

Forum powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group