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 Post subject: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:40 pm 
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thom has been unfairly banned along with anyone ( 5 other people now) who supports him. this post is to bring that to attention of the community. while thom can be a dick, most of his points are quite valid. disagreement isn't grounds for being banned in my book, and think sauaage is being a little dictator-like with the ban-stick. we should create a public topic where we can debate this issue adults, not just ban anyone that makes waves. my 2 cents...love to hear what everyone has to say (if i don't get banned too that is)

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:52 pm 
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rxdeath wrote:
thom has been unfairly banned along with anyone ( 5 other people now) who supports him. this post is to bring that to attention of the community. while thom can be a dick, most of his points are quite valid. disagreement isn't grounds for being banned in my book, and think sauaage is being a little dictator-like with the ban-stick. we should create a public topic where we can debate this issue adults, not just ban anyone that makes waves. my 2 cents...love to hear what everyone has to say (if i don't get banned too that is)


I should address this topic now. The user was not removed on the grounds of disagreement or anything of the sort. But rather a long history of issues and warnings that I will not air here.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:58 pm 
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That sounds like a reasonable cause for a ban, but what happened to the other people? :|


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:01 pm 
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Why was it that you banned other users for supporting him?


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:03 pm 
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I asked for them to remove the sig, and they did not comply.

I will ask the same for yourself please.

Admirably there is much support for this user, but this is not the place for that.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:04 pm 
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also if you decide to ban him, i think you chose a poor instance to flex your power as in this thread he's far from aggresive. i think bans should be community moderated, because it honestly sounds like you just dont like his attitude. which is fair, but hardly grounds to remove someone from the forum. also asking people to change signatures? should i burn all my books when i'm done?

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:06 pm 
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I'm sorry, where in the rules does it say that "Save Thom" is disallowed? Is it offensive? I don't think so. Banning me will only further validate everyone's opinions that you are overstepping your bounds.


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:09 pm 
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Ethan Rosen says that he would like the # put back in his signature.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:10 pm 
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I would just like to point out that '#', is the logo for a team of cubers; and is not directly affiliated with 'Save Thom'.
Therefore # should be allowed in signatures.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:18 pm 
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I think you are all forgetting something VERY important:

Sausage is the main admin here

Asking you to remove a signature is not stepping beyond his boundaries, at all. If he doesn't want it here, it doesn't go here. Its his website.

:dons flame suit:

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:21 pm 
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Ethan really wants the # back in his sig.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:22 pm 
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What the heck just happened?

Would someone please PM me? (I'd rather have this not in the thread so not to instigate anything).


Thanks.......

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:24 pm 
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I hate getting into these things but I would like to remind you all of an important announcement that was made on this forum, and is still at the top in the general topics forum. Sausage said...
Quote:
there is a small number that believe they have the right to say whatever they like and behave in whatever manner they choose. I will state up front - that on twistypuzzles.com, you do not have that right!

I believe that we are all guests here, and we can be kicked out of this hypothetical house if the owner wants us to be kicked out. I think Sausage should do what he wants.

EDIT: Also could someone please PM what completely is going on. I'm not exactly sure...

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:34 pm 
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sure he 'can', but what about 'should'? if he wants to be a dictator fine, but i wanted to bring it to the attention of the community because as i said it was poor timing...if you want to ban kirjava, great, but i don't even see what he did wrong in that particular thread, he was actually pretty civil. i don't think that the moderator not liking your attitude should be grounds for ban, its just too dictator-ship-like-ness for my taste

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:38 pm 
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rxdeath wrote:
if you want to ban kirjava, great, but i don't even see what he did wrong in that particular thread


sausage wrote:
The user was not removed on the grounds of disagreement or anything of the sort. But rather a long history of issues and warnings that I will not air here.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:41 pm 
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so then it was retroactive? you decided to ban him for something he did before now? if youre going to punish someone isn't it prudent to punish at the time of infraction rather than whenever you feel like it? is it just because you personally don't like him?

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:25 pm 
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Ethan wants the # back in his signature.


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:59 pm 
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Ethan really really really really wants the # back in his signature


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:11 pm 
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I would like to say like many others on this thread that Ethan would like the # back in his signature.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:15 pm 
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cAPSlOCKrOXX wrote:
I would like to say like many others on this thread that Ethan would like the # back in his signature.


Unfortunately, that user is no longer here, and there will be no changes. I'm sure they are quite capable of using email if there is a wish to discuss the matter.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:17 pm 
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WHY have all of these members been banned? Especially Pembo and Ethan, I don't understand at all what has been done wrong here.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:39 pm 
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Ethan really really really really wants the # back in his signature.
Please give it to him :|


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:53 pm 
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While it's obviously been said before, Ethan would really like the # back in his signature.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 10:58 pm 
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Ethan really really really really wants the # back in his signature
just give it back


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:21 pm 
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I REALLY suggest you all stop, unless you want to follow in his footsteps :?

I'm not trying to make a threat, I'm just basing this off of what has occurred today.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 2:36 am 
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professorcube5x5 wrote:
WHY have all of these members been banned? Especially Pembo and Ethan, I don't understand at all what has been done wrong here.


sausage is corrupt with power


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 6:37 am 
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Sandy and Sausage provide as a great puzzle platform for free and you're acting like kids, that do not want to share their toys.
Even if sausage would act like an dictator. He simply is allowed to. It is not a democracy here.

If you make a party at your house and there are a few guys that do not behave like you want, you simply throw them out and do not ask the other guests if it would be ok.

It is clear that a banning should not come too fast, but you all do not know how many pm's had been sent and how long the whole process from the first warning to the banning was.

To sum it up. S & S provide us this forum with their effort and Sandy's money. And you simply live by the rules or not.



Q

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 6:45 am 
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There's a difference between what people can do and what they should do.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 6:51 am 
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Danny Devitt wrote:
There's a difference between what people can do and what they should do.


Same with the users.



Q

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 11:01 am 
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yes its just a desire to show power. if someone says something racist or hateful that's one thing, but its a joke that someone got banned just because the moderator doesn't like him personally. he openly admitted there wasn't a reason behind this, just from stuff he's said (and already been punished for might i add) before, which is a disgusting abuse of power.....and since he's so drunk with power he just wants to ban anyone that opposes his unfair, biased judgement or points it out to the community. from what i understand from many of the people i talk to are pretty tired of him being the admin anyway and most would rather have sandy back. this is why there should never just be 1 admin because they always get full of themselves......


heil sausage i guess

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 2:15 pm 
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King Koopa wrote:
professorcube5x5 wrote:
WHY have all of these members been banned? Especially Pembo and Ethan, I don't understand at all what has been done wrong here.


sausage is corrupt with power

That is kinda crossing the line.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 2:33 pm 
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rxdeath wrote:
heil sausage i guess


Such historical relevant words, shouldn't be used in those circumstances. :?



Q

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You all can complain, but not in the way you are doing it.
Don't get me wrong, I would love to see Pembo and Kirjava still around.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 6:51 pm 
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Just out of curiosity, why were lostsofsloths, blade740, and KingKoopa banned from the forum?


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:01 pm 
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rxdeath wrote:
yes its just a desire to show power. if someone says something racist or hateful that's one thing, but its a joke that someone got banned just because the moderator doesn't like him personally. he openly admitted there wasn't a reason behind this, just from stuff he's said (and already been punished for might i add) before, which is a disgusting abuse of power.....and since he's so drunk with power he just wants to ban anyone that opposes his unfair, biased judgement or points it out to the community. from what i understand from many of the people i talk to are pretty tired of him being the admin anyway and most would rather have sandy back. this is why there should never just be 1 admin because they always get full of themselves......


heil sausage i guess


Not to burst your bubble, but there's 2 admins, ones just not here now. Also, you state that sausage openly said there wasn't a reason behind this, although sausage has said more than once that it was because of thom's comments and everyone else's signature. He gave them fair warning and they refused to comply.


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:05 pm 
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cubefan8 wrote:
rxdeath wrote:
yes its just a desire to show power. if someone says something racist or hateful that's one thing, but its a joke that someone got banned just because the moderator doesn't like him personally. he openly admitted there wasn't a reason behind this, just from stuff he's said (and already been punished for might i add) before, which is a disgusting abuse of power.....and since he's so drunk with power he just wants to ban anyone that opposes his unfair, biased judgement or points it out to the community. from what i understand from many of the people i talk to are pretty tired of him being the admin anyway and most would rather have sandy back. this is why there should never just be 1 admin because they always get full of themselves......


heil sausage i guess


Not to burst your bubble, but there's 2 admins, ones just not here now. Also, you state that sausage openly said there wasn't a reason behind this, although sausage has said more than once that it was because of thom's comments and everyone else's signature. He gave them fair warning and they refused to comply.


sausage wrote:
Please understand that the content of the signatures was not the issue. I cannot make that point any clearer. It was the motivation occurring behind it to try and force my hand over a decision that they did not agree with.


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:20 pm 
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sausage wrote:
I asked for them to remove the sig, and they did not comply.


I didn't mean the physical signature, but the thought behind the signature and then not listening to the admin.


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:25 pm 
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Please let's leave the "you said-he said-they said" stuff behind for now. rxdeath was understandably hurt and frustrated, to the point where he just had to let it out. It's not productive nor humane to dwell on exactly what he said under pressure.

Now that he's dropped the emotional hyperbole he seems to be focusing his efforts on a constructive discussion. While I'm skeptical of his proposal, we could use a creative and constructive solution right now. And to get that we need constructive discussion.

Let's move forward.


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:59 pm 
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Ethan requested that I post this.

WHY WE WERE BANNED FROM TWISTYPUZZLES wrote:
Guys, I have no feud with the twistypuzzles forum, in fact I like many of its members very much. An admin over stepped his boundaries. Here is a post I drew up off why we were actually banned:

This started when Thom was banned for no real reason other than Sausage just doesn't like him. Pembo and Thom were in communication, and Pembo was disgusted by Sausage's behavior. Me and Siraj entered the chat they were in, and were quickly informed of everything that happened, including the emails between Thom and Sausage. Sausage seemed to think he was some sort of god, saying things like "you come to me showing no humility." It was then that me, Pembo, and Siraj decided to change our signatures to "Save Thom." Sausage noticed it on Pembo's signature first. They had an PM conversation where Pembo said that he did not want to take it off unless there was a real explanation for why Thom was banned. At this time Rae and Speedy Mcfastfast were contacted and told to change their signatures to save Thom. Almost immediately after doing so, me and siraj got PMs asking us to change our signatures. While we were still thinking of a response, the five of us were banned. Blade740 was banned shortly after. There was no open defiance, as Rae and Speedy were never even messaged to change their signatures, and only Pembo had replied yet. Sausage then let rumors spread while making intentionally vague and uninformative posts, and then finally made his post called "situations" which contains an biased view with no actual facts where opinions are represented as facts.

As for the # in my signature, that had nothing to do with this, but it was accidentally taken out when the "Save Thom" was removed, and I still want it back.

Here is a list of people banned over this incident:
Thom, Pembo, Ethan Rosen, Siraj A, Speedy Mcfastfast, Rae, lostsofsloths, blade740, and Kingkoopa


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 9:16 pm 
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the 'idea' behind the signatures 'try and force my hand'? its funny that sausage, as an admin, has told people to ignore incessant newb posts they don't like, but if someone makes a commentary against one of his decisions, presents their ideas and gain supporters, then that is un-ignorable by him. its just such a power trip, anyone that can't see it is blind. an admin/mod should be open to criticism of their decisions, more so than regular users in my opinion. to oppress and remove anyone that they just 'don't like' is crap.

i would love to see open elections, reinstatements of everyone, and a community based vote on what should be done for further problem cases. i think that kirjava had been much better since his initial ban, and anyone that knows him knows he's been doing quite well with his manners. to retroactively punish him when he's been improvomg is a joke, like someone had a bad day and wanted to take it out on someone. this site is being run quite totalitarian like and i hope this discussion helps everyone else realize it and pull for a vote of a panel of admins.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:07 pm 
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Ethan send me a message in youtube with the same explination. So far I know that some of the 'banees' agree with Ethan's reponse. What does sausage have to say?

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:14 am 
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I agree (as far as I can judge) with the events in the message that Ethan has passed in. I don't agree with his statements, but I believe the timeline of events is accurate.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 7:52 pm 
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Really sausage? You will bother to deny anything said above?

Then explain why you retroactively banned' Thom.
Are you going to deny that you told Thom "you come to me showing no humility" as if you were some type of god?
Do you plan on denying that your posts were anything more than vague, biased and misleading? Can you please show in your posts one example of a fact?

SAVE THOM!!!! #

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 12:27 pm 
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I remember the days when this use to be a puzzle forum only. No signature, no sub forums, just a good old puzzle forum. That is all that was discussed. No wonder I don't find myself here on a daily basis anymore.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 8:30 pm 
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Mr.Twisty wrote:
I remember the days when this use to be a puzzle forum only. No signature, no sub forums, just a good old puzzle forum. That is all that was discussed. No wonder I don't find myself here on a daily basis anymore.



im a fairly new member here and that is the way I would like to see the forum but with all this childish stuff I dont think that is possible. bummer :(

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 8:42 pm 
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This is a pretty old topic. The business has been dealt with and since, the forum is more or less back it's old self.

If no one has any particular objection, I'll close this thread off.

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 8:51 pm 
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sausage wrote:
If no one has any particular objection, I'll close this thread off.

Please do.


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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 9:12 pm 
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sausage wrote:
This is a pretty old topic. The business has been dealt with and since, the forum is more or less back it's old self.

If no one has any particular objection, I'll close this thread off.


sorry sorry I didnt realize :oops: :oops: wont happen again

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 Post subject: Re: kirjava--banned
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 10:09 pm 
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No trouble at all. Not a problem. Closing now.

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