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 Post subject: 3D Printer
PostPosted: Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:48 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2004 8:31 pm
Location: Arvada, CO
Has anyone seen this?
http://www.zcorp.com/products/printersdetail.asp?ID=1

You could invent your own puzzle on your pc and print it out in a couple of hours and put it together. I wish it didn't cost so much.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 15, 2004 11:56 pm 
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Location: Marin, CA
I saw a few samples of the output of this thing and spoke to a representative last weekend. The quality of the pieces is quite amazing, although if you threw them against the floor hard they would break. They're certainly strong enough to make a prototype one could play with.

The process used to make them unfortunately makes printing a puzzle as a single unit basically unworkable. The powder inside would have no way of getting out. However, one could print some pieces in two parts so that the whole puzzle could be assembled and then the caps glued or screwed on.

Zcorp recommends that people who want just a few parts made get it done by one of the places which they've sold a machine to, which they link to. A quick cheap one costs about $10! A part which needed some care in the tolerances involved, like a twisty piece, might run more like $100, but the guy I talked to was just guessing about that. He said that for production-quality twisty puzzles my best bet is probably to get a piece printed then cast in metal, and the metal pieces can be sanded down so they turn smoothly.

I'm planning on figuring out how to get data into the format they want, and what the best way to specify it is. The interfaces to standard 3d packages seem to be mostly inappropriate for twisty puzzles, so some custom CAD software might be in order. The guy from Zcorp told me that there's a lot of custom CAD software in the world for specialized applications.

They apparently sold a 3d printer to a high school near me. I'll have to look into that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 16, 2004 11:36 am 
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I have found this site to be a very good place to get a perspective on the variety of rapid prototyping, 3D printing techniques and to be a good place to find companies to do 3D printing from model files.

Rapid-prototyping service providers: http://www.wohlersassociates.com/RP-RT- ... iders.html

Rapid-prototyping system developers:
http://www.wohlersassociates.com/RP-RT- ... opers.html


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:39 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 24, 1999 12:18 pm
Location: Palerang Shire, NSW, Australia
To me, it wouldn't matter if the parts are fragile or not. The primary concern for me would be getting a single master to cast from, not to make live pieces. I would imagine a 3d printer would be very pricey to print each piece.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 16, 2004 7:59 pm 
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Location: Athens, Georgia USA
In my journeys to create the MPS I looked at this avenue... pircey indeed.

There are some materials that should be suitable for making a working puzzle but I think Waynes idea of using the printed piece for casting is THE way to go... not only do you cut your costs down but you can cast the resin that you like the feel of...

just my $0.02 worth...

_pink


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 12:16 am 
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sausage wrote:
I would imagine a 3d printer would be very pricey to print each piece.


Just wait for the prices to drop over the next few years. I'll wager a Dogic that before TwistyPuzzles.com turns 10 we'll be posting 3D CAD files that we can individually upload to FedExKinkos.com to have fabricated and have the resulting puzzle overnighted to us by 8am the next day.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 11:10 am 
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Location: Athens, Georgia USA
Ok, so how old is Twisty currently... it's an inticing bet to say the least... :D

_pink


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2004 9:11 am 
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_pink wrote:
Ok, so how old is Twisty currently... it's an inticing bet to say the least... :D


Born on July 1st 2002.

Is anyone going to remember to resurrect this topic in 2012?!

Sandy


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2004 9:36 am 
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Location: Great State of Washington
When did the twisty megasite and Virtual puzzle museum start?

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2004 4:22 pm 
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Location: New Ulm, Minnesota, USA
The twisty megasite started I think Nov 24 1999 sometime. My first post was in April of 2000 even know I did know it was up in 1999 also.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 20, 2004 6:13 pm 
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Nov 24 1999 sounds pretty good. Gee I should know this shouldn't I?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 1:36 am 
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Heh.

Of course, I haven't heard the counter wagers. And bear in mind that if I win the bet, twisty puzzles - and anything else that is easily fabricated - are massively devalued, so I'd be expecting something that'll retain its value in the face of that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 24, 2004 2:03 pm 
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Joshua Bell wrote:
Of course, I haven't heard the counter wagers. And bear in mind that if I win the bet, twisty puzzles - and anything else that is easily fabricated - are massively devalued, so I'd be expecting something that'll retain its value in the face of that.


I'm not about to make a counter-wager, but I can't see any chain of office service stores offering such a service. I can't imagine that the average person has any use for such a service, regardless of how cool it is. This type of tool will certainly become more and more common,but it's uses are pretty specific to people wanting prototypes of new inventions, isn't it?!

The odd person might decide to make a hobby project out of making a custom cell phone case or something like that, but given the amount of work involved in designing the new thing, I just don't see it getting used a lot.

Now when they can start to "print" FOOD orders out, then we're talking major demand!

Sandy


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 30, 2004 9:46 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2001 12:30 am
Location: Montreal, Canada
aditionnal info on 3D printers...

"George Miller's website http://www.puzzlepalace.com features many new 3D-printed puzzles, designed by Oskar van Deventer -- "Oskar's Exotics". Many different 3D printing technologies were investigated to produce these puzzles. All technologies build physical models layer by layer.
Inkjet printer technology that cures starch or plaster (3D color prints!).
Glue printers that bind steel powder which is then sintered.
Lasers heaters that fuse nylon powder or liquid particles together.
Laser cutters that build layered paper models.
Nozzles that deposit wax droplets for lost-wax casting.
Extruders that deposit thin wires of ABS.

George Miller is using the last technique, the ABS extruder, which he describes as a "giant glue gun". All technologies are mainly used for rapid prototyping, as it only takes several hours to create accurate fully functioning prototypes. Each technology has its own specifications for resolution/accuracy, strength and (im)possibilities. All technologies are still rather expensive, both in terms of equipment and materials. Despite that, George predicts that in ten years many people will have a 3D printer next to their desk.  For now, this printer technology allows construction of puzzles that could not otherwise be built."

More info here:

http://www.mathpuzzle.com/

Michael
:wink:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 01, 2004 12:59 am 
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Location: Delft, the Netherlands
Not really puzzle related, but Bathsheba Grossman makes some really neat sculptures using metal 3d printing:
http://www.bathsheba.com/

I have the one shown on the main page, about 2 inches high and very strong. Unfortunately this technique is no good for twisty puzzles since the surface is not smooth enough.

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Jaap's Puzzle Page:
http://www.jaapsch.net/puzzles/


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