Online since 2002. Over 3300 puzzles, 2600 worldwide members, and 270,000 messages.

TwistyPuzzles.com Forum

It is currently Sat Apr 19, 2014 2:54 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 8 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Das Pronto modelling clay
PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2003 6:33 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 11, 2003 8:18 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia
How on earth do you use a modelling clay like Das Pronto to make puzzle pieces? The parts need mathematical accuracy, so I'm just wondering whether anyone can give any tips on how this can be achieved. If it's just up to me to squish the clay around into the right shape, it ain't gonna happen! :-)

I can probably print out nets on cardboard from Stella to some extent, and squash the clay into the 3D cardboard "mold", but that's not a complete solution.

Is Das Pronto suitable for:
- Making parts for use in a working prototype?
- Making plastic molds from?

Would Sculpey, Fimo, or something else be better? I haven't seen Milliput in action, but it seems popular here. What are the pros and cons?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Das Pronto modelling clay
PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2003 9:53 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 6:14 am
Location: Orange County, CA, USA
I have no experience with Das Pronto but if it's strictly a modelling clay then it would not be suitable if it doesn't cure to a good hard material. For that purpose working with something like Milliput or its rival Magic Sculp is about the only way to go for making shaped puzzle pieces. Other two part epoxy putties exist and I use some fast drying stuff for some of my builds, but Milliput and Magic Sculp can be sanded to fine finishes unlike many other puttys.

For prototyping pieces I would use the above mentioned because once they cure they are almost hard as rocks and will maintain their shape.

Pros of Milliput - You can get it in black now! It is very fine so holds detail very well. Also doesn't shrink when curing. It can also be easily sculpted for several hours after initially mixing.

Cons - Tends to be somewhat expensive compared to its chief alternative, Magic Sculp. Personally I would rather work with Magic Sculp but it dries to an almost transparent greenish-bluish color and has a slight odor to it (not unpleasant) so is not really suitable for making final pieces unless you are painting. It's easier to initially mix than Milliput too, which is always nice.

As for the question about mathematical accuracy, I seem to recall someone a long while ago making several puzzles strictly with white Milliput (Carter?) that was later painted black. After initially shaping the pieces and allowing the Milliput to dry, the puzzle was turned and mixed over and over while the sides were sanded to match. Quite an arduous process.

Yes, mathematical accuracy in those cases is a matter of "eyeball accuracy" which can be quite good. To improve precision some people are using pieces of flat plastic (like credit card type plastic) to make prototype pieces.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Das Pronto modelling clay
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2003 9:53 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 24, 1999 12:18 pm
Location: Palerang Shire, NSW, Australia
I used Das Pronto back when I was designing a 4x4x4. That was before I found Milliput. Don't bother with Das. I should remove references of it from Twisty.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Das Pronto modelling clay
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2003 11:17 am 
I've messed with Sculpey a bit. It's not hard enough at all for finished pieces. You can make dents and round off edges with your fingernail. Plus it shrinks a bit. It'd probably be OK for making rough shapes that can be carved into prototype pieces for making molds from. As of late I've been slowly-but-surely messing around a bit with making some experimental pieces this way.


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Das Pronto modelling clay
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2003 11:23 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 11, 2003 8:18 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Alright, so consensus is Milliput wins over Das and Sculpey.

What about my plan to use a cardboard mold? I'd like to make the shape I want out of cardboard and then squish the Milliput (or whatever) into it to make the shape. Cardboard is convenient as I can print the nets required straight onto it, but I'm guessing this wouldn't work very well. The Milliput will surely stick to the card.

Has anyone done something like this already, and maybe has a solution? Eg make the shape out of bits of phone cards or something? That would still stick though, right? Could I wet it first to prevent sticking? Is there some flat solid material that it won't stick to?

Thanks,
Rob.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Das Pronto modelling clay
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2003 11:42 am 
Never heard of that before. I guess if you used a very glossy card and sprayed it with bees wax release spray it shouldn't stick. I think the proble would be that the card would bulge as you pushed the milliput into the corners.

I always figured the best way to use nets would be to print them on address labels and stick to sheet material. Then cut out the faces and glue them up, may be filling with milliput for strength and weight. I am guessing this is close to how Anthony Greenhill builds his master pieces. Clearly a mini table saw that can cut mitred edges would make this a very power full technique.

Max


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Das Pronto modelling clay
PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2003 3:30 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 2:19 pm
Location: Yaroslavl, Russia and Maryland, USA
I am considering the technique of making pieces in molds that are made of paper. That will give an accuracy that is close to precise. My idea is to make molds out of paper, so you don't make a paper model of the piece, and then fill it with milliput/etc, and the use that as a master to produce a mold. What you make is a mold made of paper, that is pretty strong with _outside_ support, and probably some inserts inside, if a piece needs that, and then pour urethane into that mold. Yes, the best would if paper did not stick to whatever you make your pieces from. However, if it sticks, that should not be a problem anyway, as only the inner part of the paper mold would stick. What you will get is a thin paper layer outside the piece, say, from 0.1mm to 0.5mm of paper outside your piece, which is easily sanded off the piece. In fact, I am considering this method as the one of throw away molds, so that you simply make you molds out of paper anytime you make that piece, and don't bother with the silicone/etc molds. That will work for lots of pieces, but certainly not for everything. The net of a mold - you can probably use the programm that Robert wrote. I write Postscript programs that can take parameters and draw me a net of the mold scaled to the required size.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Das Pronto modelling clay
PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2003 3:30 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 6:14 am
Location: Orange County, CA, USA
I don't recommend using Milliput pushed into paper molds. Milliput is pretty stiff so might not push in too well into corners if the paper or cardboard is unsupported. Magic Sculp is probably better for that particular purpose. Supported by metal sheets though, that might work but it might be tough to maneuver sheets into the angles necessary for that sort of work.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 8 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Kattenvriendin and 7 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

Forum powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group