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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 2:00 pm 
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Hi Schuma, do I need to know how to solve the non-circle version of 1.1.25 before attempting this?

-Mark- :)

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 2:37 pm 
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APJ wrote:
Door wrote:
Now, onto some more tricky stuff :D

Of course! :lol: I had a go at the dino cube with centres and 'corners' (3.2.6) at about 12 o'clock last night and couldn't get the centres and 'corners' done on more than one side. :oops:

Alex


Ahh, good old Rex cube! I used to solve this one all the time. Quite strange really, I was getting times of around 25 mins, 30 mins, that area. But then I thought I would try solving the corners and centers at the same time as the edges. Made my time go down to about 8 mins! With practice I managed to get #1 in this puzzle time, with 2:29, as my first #1, until Michael Gottlieb completely shattered my time with 1:18 :x .

But anyway, here's a brief(not really :lol: ) outline on how to solve it, the simple way(edges first then other parts):

Notation

Ok this is the notation used For vertex turning puzzles such as this:

Attachment:
File comment: Rex notation
Rexnotation.gif
Rexnotation.gif [ 16.49 KiB | Viewed 4160 times ]


Algorithms

I only use a few algorithms when solving this.

These include:

1. (FLU' BRU FLU BRU') - This is a pretty simple algorithm, it just does this(Opps, upside down picture alert!):
Attachment:
File comment: Cycle
rexcycle.gif
rexcycle.gif [ 4.3 KiB | Viewed 4160 times ]


2. (FLU FRD' FLU' FRD) (BRU' FRD BRU FRD') - This is also very useful while solving. It is based off the last algorithm. It moves the same as pieces before, except instead of changing which faces they are on, it flips the pieces on the front face and the up face. NOTE: Do not do this algorithm in the following case. It will mess up the front side. You want the swapping pieces on the up face, and the front side solved(Or the other way around).
Attachment:
File comment: Oh no!
rexwarning.gif
rexwarning.gif [ 15.18 KiB | Viewed 4164 times ]



3. (FLU' BRU' FLU BRU) - This does a similar thing to Alg. 1 except it cycles the parts on the Front, Up and Back faces.

Solving

Attachment:
File comment: Solving the rex cube.
RexSolving.gif
RexSolving.gif [ 41.57 KiB | Viewed 3735 times ]


The steps in solving are as follows(Numbers correspond to the picture of the solving steps):

1. Solve the dino cube edges. Be sure to have the correct colour scheme(BOY around a corner)

2. Use setup moves to match 2 triangle pieces, as shown with the red on the up face.

3. Put the pieces into place using algorithm #1 or #3. After you have put your triangles in place, be sure to undo your setup move(s)!

4. Now use algorithm #1 or #3 to match the center of the face you added to in step 3 with a triangle that isn't on the face yet (So I would add the Red center to a red triangle that wasn't on the red face). Then you can match up the last triangle with the triangle and center, as shown in the picture on the up face.

5. Once again, use Algorithms 1 or 3 to put the 2 triangles and a center into their places. Remember to undo the setup move(s).

6. If you match something up, but can't put it into its spot, you can put it into an already solved face. In my case I matched the Blue triangles up on the blue side, and needed to undo a setup move. I moved it onto the solved red side, so that only pieces that were on the unsolved white side would get messed up. After I undo my setup move(s), I can put the reds back into their places and then put the blue triangle pair in at the same time.

7. Just repeating steps 2-5, I managed to solve it up to here. The other 3 sides you cannot see are solved.

8. Now is where algorithm #2 is crucial. From picture 7, I did a BRU move, and then rotated the cube so it is at the view shown. Then I did algorithm #2 and the green and white triangles get swapped on the up face. Seeing as there are matching colour triangles on the front face, it does not get messed up at all.

9. In this case I have got to the last piece, but cannot do a setup move and then algorithm #2 without messing another face up. I had to move the pieces around using Algorithm #1, then did a clockwise turn on the closest corner, and rotated the puzzle so it is at the view on picture 10.

10. Algorithm #2 is done here, so that the white triangle and center are flush with the blue pieces on the top face. The orange is with the whites. Then I undo my setup move and do one last Algorithm, #1 to finish.

-Mark- :)

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Last edited by Door on Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:13 pm 
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Door wrote:
Hi Schuma, do I need to know how to solve the non-circle version of 1.1.25 before attempting this?

-Mark- :)


Hi Mark, I think once you figure out how to solve (1.1.4), you can try (1.1.25). (1.1.25) is not related to
(1.1.22~24). Of course that is my experience and that does not necessarily work for you.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:56 pm 
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I checked the list of puzzles, and I see only a few not solved!
4.3.5 - the octahedron, a very long time no one wants to solve it
for he has all the formulas, somebody needs to do it.
viewtopic.php?p=127974#p127974
Image

5.1.9 - a new circle-pyramid, no one dared to throw her a call.
Image

and several sphere: 6.1.1d, 6.1.1e, 6.2.1, 6.2.1b, 6.2.1c

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 10:14 am 
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I tried 5.1.9 again yesterday, and got everything except every piece inside the circles. The rest I did like a master pyraminx.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 4:09 am 
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Hi, I need some help with 3.3.3. I'm finally attempting one of those horrible edge turning things, and need help swapping 2 centers. Here is where I am up to:

Attachment:
File comment: 1
3.3.gif
3.3.gif [ 18.14 KiB | Viewed 3741 times ]


The way I plan on solving this is:

1. Corners, like a helicopter cube's corners
2. Centers and triangles next to centers at the same time, using intuition and algorithms.
3. The triangles by the corners using algorithms.
4. The edges, again with algorithms.

I have to swap the 2 centers in order to continue. Mabye some horrible parity :o ?

-Mark- :wink:

EDIT: found out what was wrong, needed to move the corners around the cube a quarter, like the way you move the edges around on a void cube's parity.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 9:40 pm 
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I don't know what to do now, I can't seem to get any further on 3.3.3, with the algorithms I worked out :(


Attachments:
edgeturningcube.gif
edgeturningcube.gif [ 20.81 KiB | Viewed 3742 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 5:20 pm 
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The circle helicopter cube is pretty awesome. Thanks for all these new puzzles gelatinbrain :) (And I haven't even solved all the old ones yet!)

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 6:02 pm 
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qqwref wrote:
The circle helicopter cube is pretty awesome. Thanks for all these new puzzles gelatinbrain :) (And I haven't even solved all the old ones yet!)


I just noticed that circle helicopter cube. It is awesome. By the way, who is gelatinbrain... I mean the person that is making all these nice applets? Are they a member here? Are ideas like this circle helicopter cube their original idea, do they take requests, or some combination of both?

Carl

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 6:06 pm 
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He's a member here. But he rarely posts..... Also it seems that he sometimes takes suggestions from us by just reading through posts. You can also find an email that he at least knows of (dunno if its automated or he actually manually checks it) if you scroll down on any puzzle.

Peace,
Matt Galla


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:23 pm 
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Finally, today, I solved the helicopter cube on my first try without the aid of previously discovered algs! (read: this means i did not refer to a different page to solve it; the techniques i used may have been described before.) PS i did this in a little over 51 minutes.
Image

step 1- solve the 1st layer corners intuitively
not really much to say here, this is pretty easy
step 2- solve the face-pieces of the 1st layer
i used a intuitive alg for this that switches 3 face-pieces, i'm pretty sure there is a more optimal way. During the long break we have, i'm going to do some more experimentation.
step 3- solve the rest of the bottom half of the cube (aka solve middle centers)
i do this step intuitively. CAn't really describe right now, I will post sometime next week describing the process.
step 4- solve the top layer corners
this step was relatively easy, although you do need to know one alg for orienting the last 2 corners (if that is necessary)
step 5- solve the rest of the centers
I admit, this step was all luck for me. Sorry! :oops:


well, I am really happy i finally solved this thing!

~lol, monopoly.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 11:24 am 
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I solved 5.1.19 yesterday. It's important to notice that the pieces in the circles indicated in the picture are linked. After recognizing this, it's not very hard to figure out the algorithms.


Attachments:
5119.PNG
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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 10:25 am 
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grigr wrote:
4.3.5 - the octahedron, a very long time no one wants to solve it
for he has all the formulas, somebody needs to do it.
viewtopic.php?p=127974#p127974
Image

I have finally put 4.3.5 on the board. First I placed 6 corner-edge pieces around a face, then I cycled the rest with (6,1) non-pure commutators. I could have solved the rest of the puzzle in any order, but I chose to move from the outside inwards: regular edges with (5,1) pure commutators, then outer centers (4,1) pure, then inner centers (6,1) pure. I found 4.3.5 quite confusing to solve because I often needed to use several moves to set up cycles even near the beginning, and when so little of the puzzle is solved it's easy to lose track of which face is which! I rate this one in between 4.3.1 and 4.3.2 in difficulty. The algos I used are in "invisible ink" below; highlight the text to see:

Corner-edges: (BD BL ur BL ur BD, dr)
Other edges: (BD DL UL DL BD, DR or FD) *pure
Outer centers: (fu fr fu fr, fl) *pure
Inner centers: (FD fu fr fu fr FD, ur) *pure


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:57 pm 
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Julian... you passed me! Grr, now I have to solve more puzzles! Maybe if I actually figure out the circle puzzles... so far I only know the cube and megaminx. In any case, I'll have to reclaim my place at some point! :wink: Congrats in the mean time.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 6:24 pm 
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Danny Devitt wrote:
Julian... you passed me! Grr, now I have to solve more puzzles! Maybe if I actually figure out the circle puzzles... so far I only know the cube and megaminx. In any case, I'll have to reclaim my place at some point! :wink: Congrats in the mean time.

Thanks! I have a cube week planned for next week (3.3.3, 3.3.4, 3.3.8, 3.1.5, and 3.1.6), then I'll focus on the tetrahedra for a while (20 to solve). Enjoy the circle puzzles!


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 1:59 pm 
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Anyone else having problems with GB? When I click on a puzzle, it takes me to the normal page but there is a big blank space and the.....'thing'.........isn't appearing. By 'thing' I mean the whole puzzle bit. :D :roll:

Alex

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:06 pm 
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It's working fine for me, try refreshing the page and see if that makes it load?

Otherwise try ctrl+f5, that'll reload the page without using anything your browser has cached.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 2:33 pm 
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That's strange - I left it for half an hour and now it's working. I don't know what was wrong with it before. :?:

Alex

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 3:39 pm 
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Gelatinbrain has added 8 new cube puzzles! Four circle cubes, plus four that turn like, well, like this:

Attachment:
File comment: Gelatinbrain 3.9.1
hexa_f25.gif
hexa_f25.gif [ 2.23 KiB | Viewed 3577 times ]


:shock: :arrow: :D

Thanks again, Gelatinbrain!


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 3:44 pm 
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Those are evil! I love it!

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 3:49 pm 
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:x Not making my GB plans any easier.. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:15 pm 
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Retr0 wrote:
:x Not making my GB plans any easier.. :lol:

At this rate, you'll never solve them all. :lol:

Alex

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:28 pm 
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cant cant see the 8 new puzzles on gelatin brain :( :x ¬Ņwhat gives?

edit:
got it working!!! thanks for the help.

figured out most of the circle cubes. :lol:

cant get the 4x4 with the larger circle in it though. :(

i took a look at the odd corner spinning ones, dont think ill be figuring them out any time soon. :roll:


Last edited by boublez on Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 4:34 pm 
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Try hitting ctrl+f5 on GelatinBrain's page.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 5:11 pm 
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ive been working on the tetrahedrons and i keep getting this problem. it feels alot like parity. :( does anybody know how to fix it?


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 4:45 am 
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boublez wrote:
ive been working on the tetrahedrons and i keep getting this problem. it feels alot like parity. :( does anybody know how to fix it?


I guess you could call it a parity, because you cannot get that on a HM tetrahedron/Jing's Pyraminx. I get that alot too. Either I just start again, or rotate so that the centers are in the right place and stuff up the edges a bit. I then fix the edges and see it its right. If not, I either start again or repeat this process. Sorry I can't help more :?

-Mark- :)

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 2:33 pm 
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Door wrote:
I guess you could call it a parity, because you cannot get that on a HM tetrahedron/Jing's Pyraminx. I get that alot too. Either I just start again, or rotate so that the centers are in the right place and stuff up the edges a bit. I then fix the edges and see it its right. If not, I either start again or repeat this process. Sorry I can't help more :?

-Mark- :)


i was afraid that was the case luckily it doesn't kill me to start these things overs.


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 3:45 pm 
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Julian wrote:
Gelatinbrain has added 8 new cube puzzles! Four circle cubes, plus four that turn like, well, like this:

Attachment:
hexa_f25.gif


:shock: :arrow: :D

Thanks again, Gelatinbrain!

So... there are internal "stickers". Do they also have to be aligned for the puzzle to count as solved? This is similar to Rubik's Triamid (if I remember the name correctly).


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 11:36 am 
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Julian wrote:
Gelatinbrain has added 8 new cube puzzles! Four circle cubes, plus four that turn like, well, like this:
Attachment:
hexa_f25.gif

Thanks again, Gelatinbrain!


Gelatinbrain You can add to this class: 4 * 4 + internal 2 * 2

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 3:50 pm 
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bhearn wrote:
So... there are internal "stickers". Do they also have to be aligned for the puzzle to count as solved? This is similar to Rubik's Triamid (if I remember the name correctly).


I solved 3.9.1 and the internal stickers do not have to be aligned. This rule makes the puzzler a little bit easier.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:07 pm 
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These 3.9.x puzzles are very wierd. Any piece can go in any position, but only with certain orientations(I think). Anyway, this is how far I got after 30 minutes(Actually about 15, but i spent another 15 trying to improve it, but got nowhere :P ):

Attachment:
File comment: 1
funny3x3x3.gif
funny3x3x3.gif [ 18.48 KiB | Viewed 3407 times ]


Any tips?

-Mark- :)

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:59 pm 
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In 3.9.1, I think all pieces are identical. You only need to rotate them. (of course it doesn't hurt to switch them)

Since the LUF 2x2x2 corner and the RDB 2x2x2 corner have only one intersection piece, it's easy to make a 3-cycle by four moves. Then you can use another different 3-cycle to get the three moved pieces back. The net effect will be, all pieces back in place but rotated. Then you can use this algorithm again and again to solve the cube. The center pieces do not need to be correctly oriented, because the internal stickers are not required to be aligned.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 10:04 pm 
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Tonight gelatin brain updated the page again, adding two 3.9.* puzzles. Now we can customize the number of scrambles. There is a "algorithm" textbar. But I don't know how that works. It would be great if I can paste a sequence of moves and apply it automatically.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 7:24 pm 
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Door wrote:
I don't know what to do now, I can't seem to get any further on 3.3.3, with the algorithms I worked out :(
Hi, sorry for the very late reply, but I suggest you first solve the edges from the stage shown in your screenshot, which is easy to do when you don't care what happens to the triangles; then finish by solving the triangles with pure algos. The triangles come in two sets which must be solved separately. A (6,1) commutator is possible, where the 6 moves consist of [setup move] + [2 edges back and forth twice] + [undo setup move], isolating a single triangle.

Bonus: The same algo can also be used to solve the equivalent pieces in 3.3.2, 3.3.4, 3.3.5, 3.3.6, 4.3.2, and 4.3.4. 7 for the price of 1 = good value! :D (N.B. With all of the puzzles I've listed except for 3.3.2, the algo isn't pure, but it doesn't need to be. Always solve these pieces immediately after the edges.)


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 5:44 pm 
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I added a function to input algorithms.
The syntaxes are based on conventional algorithm descriptions, but not completely compatible.
To support all kind of twisty puzzles, some conventional notations are not supported and my own new features are added.

Here is an example for 7x7x7 cube.
Too see, copy and paste the following text in the algorithm text-bar below the puzzle.

/*begin*/
U, // turns the 1st layer of the face 'U' 90¬ļ clockwise
D&2, // turns the 2nd layer of the face 'D' 90¬ļ clockwise
F&3, // turns the top two layers of the face 'F' 90¬ļ clockwise
F&5, // turns the 1st and 3rd layers of the face 'F' 90¬ļ clockwise
B2, // turns the 1st layer of the face 'B' 180¬ļ
L', // turns the 1st layer of the face 'L' 90¬ļcounter-clockwise
R'&3, // turns the top two layers of the face 'R' 90¬ļ counter-clockwise
[U,D&2,F&3]x2, // repeat twice the sequence between '[' and ']'.
[B,[U,D&2,F&3]x2,U]x3, // block nesting
/*end*/

Notations for cubes
Image
Image
Notations for Dodecahedra.
Image
Inversed
Image

·The cases are ignored('F' and 'f' indicate the same face)
·Vertices and edges are identified by combinations of face identifiers.
The order doesn't matter("URF","RUF","RFU","UFR","FUR" and "FRU" all indicate the same vertex).
·Spaces, tabs, line-feeds and comments(between '/*' and '*/' or between '//' and the end of line) are ignored.
·Operations are separated by commas(,).
·The notations for octahedrons and icosahedrons correspond those of cubes and dodecahedrons respectively
but faces and vertices interchanged.

Any questions?

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 6:11 pm 
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gelatinbrain wrote:
I added a function to input algorithms.
Thanks! This is convenient, not only to save time executing longer algos in solves, but also we can now quote an algo in this thread using this notation, without having to provide our own diagrams. :)

I've noticed that for puzzles with 72 degree turns, 144 degrees counterclockwise can be typed as A'2 or A3, and 72 degrees counterclockwise can be typed as A' or A4.

Useful 1.1.25 algo: A,F,C,F',C',A',K,A,C,F,C',F',A',K'


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 6:25 pm 
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Door wrote:
These 3.9.x puzzles are very wierd. Any piece can go in any position, but only with certain orientations(I think).


The pieces of 3.9.x could be divided in two groups like in the picture below.
Image
In case 3x3x3, all pieces can move to any of 27 places, but the pieces moved to the other group have only odd orientations
(orientations availabe by the combination of odd number of rotations around any x,y,z axes),
and the pieces moved within the same group, only even orientations.
In case 4x4x4, pieces can only move within the same group, but can take any of 24 orientations.
8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 6:43 pm 
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This algorithm feature seems very powerful... but maybe TOO powerful! I just did a Pentultimate solve in 3:59 (>300 moves btw) and I am sure this can be substantially improved. Because you can just copy+paste the algorithm in whenever you want to use it, many of the long tricky puzzles (which depend on doing the same alg or commutator over and over to do 3-cycles) can be done quite quickly, perhaps in half the normal time or less.

EDIT: gelatinbrain, can you make the algorithms animate (IF animation is on)? It'd be nice to be able to see what's going on, rather than just having it treated as a magic 3-cycle or whatever. (However, if animation is off I'd like the algorithm to take 0 time.)

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 6:54 pm 
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Just solved 1.1.2! Not amazingly difficult but the complexity of the puzzles that I'm solving is increasing! :D

Alex

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 10:27 pm 
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Hey guys. This is actualy my first post :) it would have been allot sooner but i never got a confirmation email that i got in so i thought i got rejectd but today, around 5 months later i triedd again and turns out i was already a member :roll: So i started using gelatinbrain about 6 months ago (only a month after i got my first ever rubik's cube and solved it) and i have to say MANNY THANKS TO GELATINBRAIN for his amazing site!

P.S i see Julian didn't like me having the 1st in fewest moves on the super pentultimate 8-) but now he has beaten it and i don't think i can get below 250 moves so i think i'll just let it be (for now :) )

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 1:13 am 
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OK, this definitely is a bit too powerful... I got a 2:33 Pentultimate solve :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 10:56 am 
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So, it seems all the time records are obsolete and will be reset in no time.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 11:41 am 
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gelatinbrain wrote:
·The notations for octahedrons and icosahedrons correspond those of cubes and dodecahedrons respectively
but faces and vertices interchanged.

Any questions?


I don't understand the notation for octahedra. For example, for a cube, "U" is the face above the center of the left view.
Ideally speaking, in an octahedron, there should be a vertex above the center of the left view, which is called "U". But in
the perspective of octahedra, there is no such vertex. So I did some experiment on 4.2.1. When I open the puzzle, "U"
stands for the center vertex in the left view. But when I drag it to change the viewpoint, "U" stands for something else.
Is this a bug or just because I don't understand it? There is the same issue for icosahedra.

Thanks

--schuma

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 1:28 pm 
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schuma wrote:
gelatinbrain wrote:
I don't understand the notation for octahedra. For example, for a cube, "U" is the face above the center of the left view.
Ideally speaking, in an octahedron, there should be a vertex above the center of the left view, which is called "U". But in
the perspective of octahedra, there is no such vertex. So I did some experiment on 4.2.1. When I open the puzzle, "U"
stands for the center vertex in the left view. But when I drag it to change the viewpoint, "U" stands for something else.
Is this a bug or just because I don't understand it? There is the same issue for icosahedra.

Thanks

--schuma


Yes, there was a bug, but I've just fixed it. And maybe my explanation was not clear enough.
Here is the notation map for octahedron and icosahedron.
Image
Image

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 7:35 pm 
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Hey, gelatinbrain, do you think you could make it so that using the algorithm function makes the time of a solve invalid? (If you do this, please remove my best time for the Pentultimate, since I used the algorithm function for it.) I think it's unfair to everyone who has spent a lot of time trying to solve the very long puzzles, since now they can be done so much faster, so it is almost like cheating compared to the old way.

Also: Ethan Rosen says he thinks the algorithm function has made the puzzle part of the applet a little smaller, and he requests that you make the applet bigger or something, to increase the size of the puzzles back to what they were before.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2010 12:03 pm 
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qqwref wrote:
Hey, gelatinbrain, do you think you could make it so that using the algorithm function makes the time of a solve invalid? (If you do this, please remove my best time for the Pentultimate, since I used the algorithm function for it.) I think it's unfair to everyone who has spent a lot of time trying to solve the very long puzzles, since now they can be done so much faster, so it is almost like cheating compared to the old way.

Also: Ethan Rosen says he thinks the algorithm function has made the puzzle part of the applet a little smaller, and he requests that you make the applet bigger or something, to increase the size of the puzzles back to what they were before.
Or a separate table for solves that used algo's and a table for solves without them.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:33 pm 
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qqwref wrote:
Hey, gelatinbrain, do you think you could make it so that using the algorithm function makes the time of a solve invalid? (If you do this, please remove my best time for the Pentultimate, since I used the algorithm function for it.) I think it's unfair to everyone who has spent a lot of time trying to solve the very long puzzles, since now they can be done so much faster, so it is almost like cheating compared to the old way.
A compromise would be for the Apply button to carry a cost of one second per move. This would presumably be very easy to code, especially as no change whatsoever would need to be made to the rankings page.


Last edited by Julian on Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:58 pm 
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Elwyn wrote:
Hey guys. This is actualy my first post :) it would have been allot sooner but i never got a confirmation email that i got in so i thought i got rejectd but today, around 5 months later i triedd again and turns out i was already a member :roll: So i started using gelatinbrain about 6 months ago (only a month after i got my first ever rubik's cube and solved it) and i have to say MANNY THANKS TO GELATINBRAIN for his amazing site!

P.S i see Julian didn't like me having the 1st in fewest moves on the super pentultimate 8-) but now he has beaten it and i don't think i can get below 250 moves so i think i'll just let it be (for now :) )

Welcome! I've been looking forward to seeing you here, as we least moves afficionados seem to be few and far between. I think your solving is very sharp for someone so new to twisty puzzles.

The Pentultimate was the first difficult puzzle I solved here, so I feel a bit possessive of the Pentultimate "family" (1.1.6-1.1.7b) and I competed against your new record on instinct. But a soon as I saw that I'd knocked you off the least moves ranking board completely, I felt a bit sheepish. :oops: You deserve to be on there. My 243 moves for the Super-Pentultimate was pretty lucky. If you just hit Scramble as soon as you see you can't get to 15 corners left after around 95 moves (assuming you solve in a similar order to me), and only pursue good chances, after a short while you'll probably get a sub-250 solve.


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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2010 5:47 pm 
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Julian wrote:
qqwref wrote:
Hey, gelatinbrain, do you think you could make it so that using the algorithm function makes the time of a solve invalid? (If you do this, please remove my best time for the Pentultimate, since I used the algorithm function for it.) I think it's unfair to everyone who has spent a lot of time trying to solve the very long puzzles, since now they can be done so much faster, so it is almost like cheating compared to the old way.
A compromise would be for the Apply button to carry a cost of one second per move. This would presumably be very easy to code, especially as no change whatsoever would need to be made to the rankings page.


EDIT: My mistake, I misread. I still think a second per move is not enough, though, since tricky algorithms (especially those involving multiple clicks counting as one move) will almost always take longer than this to execute. I'd suggest something more like 5 or 10 seconds per move, which would again give an advantage to people who do it without macros without making macros completely unusable.

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 Post subject: Re: Gelatin Brain's Applet Solutions Discussion Thread
PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2010 6:23 pm 
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qqwref wrote:
Julian wrote:
A compromise would be for the Apply button to carry a cost of one second per move. This would presumably be very easy to code, especially as no change whatsoever would need to be made to the rankings page.
EDIT: My mistake, I misread. I still think a second per move is not enough, though, since tricky algorithms (especially those involving multiple clicks counting as one move) will almost always take longer than this to execute. I'd suggest something more like 5 or 10 seconds per move, which would again give an advantage to people who do it without macros without making macros completely unusable.
Yes, on second thought I agree with you.


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