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 Post subject: switching methods
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 2:58 pm 
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I've decide to switch from petrus to petrich. the only difference is the last layer. instead of doing the corners than edges I do OLL and PLL. the OLL is very simple because I only need 7 different algs. the PLL is not as hard as I thought it would be. I already learned 14 algs in one day and I am woeking on doing them fast. does anyone have some tips?

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 3:43 pm 
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I use OLL and PLL, too. I do know some easy COLL algs though, but not very much. I really like the fact that there are only 7 OLL cases, because it's easy to learn all of them very well from many angles. And PLL is pretty easy indeed, 21 algs isn't much and recognizing them is simple after some practice.

Learning 14 algs in one day is rather much. But I think it's ok, just practice them very well. I hate the feeling when I learn too many algs too fast and forget them because of that. Now, when I learn a new alg, I always do it 100+ times in a row. And I'll repeat that after a few hours and then my fingers just remember it.

Good luck!

-
Johannes Laire


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:07 pm 
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I already knew 7 from fixing only edges or corners. So far my fastest time with the new method is 20.xx I was able to see the OLL just before I finished the F2L which came together very quickly with no delays. I decided to switch because the 27 algs I used to fix the corners took a long time to do. but I still need them to do the LL in one step on a 2x2x2. I'm also experimenting with step 1 and 2 and making a half cross with 3 edges then doing the c/e pairs in 2 algs for the CFOP method. I think this could be much faster because it wont all be intuitive.

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:38 pm 
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I think doing cross with 3 edges and then 2 c/e pairs is a really bad idea. It can be easier, that's true. And maybe it seems faster at first, but it uses too many moves. And you learn nothing about blocks if you do it this way. Doing things intuitively makes you learn how the cube works and how to build blocks using few moves. My goal is to average 3-4 seconds for the 2x2x3 some day, and I know it's possible. Starting with a half cross 5-6 seconds is possible, but after a lot of practice doing it intuitively is a better way. Now I can usually see at least 2x2x2 and a c/e pair during inspection, and with practice seeing the whole 2x2x3 should be possible almost every time.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 4:55 pm 
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I just think it would be faster because the peices can be put in with very fast algs. but when I'm speed cubing I always find myself doing it the othe way. I'm pretty good at block building. I can get the F2L in 13 to 15 seconds. I need two work on step 2. I always put in an edge and then try to get a c/e pair to put in. I don't know why. most people are impressed with this speed with the petrus method.

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 5:16 pm 
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Yeah, it's true that F2L algs are really fast. But using algs so early, when hardly anything is solved, seems a bit odd to me. I think that intuition is faster once mastered, but it's just my opinion of course.

13-15 secs for F2L is pretty good. What do you average for the whole cube? Step 2 is the hardest part for me. I used to place the corner first and then the edges, but that's of course pretty dumb. I just practiced 2x2x3 for 1-2 weeks and didn't time my solves. That made me almost 2 seconds faster, and I still have many things to learn.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 5:35 pm 
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I have a bad cube with horrible stickers and i average 18.6 with petrus method, yet so many people quit thinking it is slow. Too bad.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 5:44 pm 
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for the whole cube my best average was 21.xx but my current average is probably 25 or so, depends on what PLL it is. My luckyest solve was 16.1 which was amazing. because at the time I had a 29 average. sometimes I will get a break and the F2L will come very fast and I will get sub 20. I will try what you did to get faster withe the 2x2x3.

the thing with the petrus method is it takes a long time to get competitively good at it. I've been cubing for almost 3 years now and I have yet to get a sub 20 average.

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 6:36 pm 
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learning to do 50% of PLLs backwards and side to side as well as OLLs.short bursts of speed when pairing easy pieces helps a ton.Last thing that saves time is doing bad edges in one smooth fast move.

this will get you sub 20.

I often hit 13's and 14's now.Petrus method is fast, but still i want to test ZB with it by cutting out bad edges step just to see how fast it is.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 6:55 pm 
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Those advice are good. But even if you know only one alg for every PLL you can get really fast, if you don't like learning. When you are really fast you can learn some more. I also speed up if I know what to do, metronome doesn't seem to work with Petrus.

I'm not getting many 13's yet, but I hope to average that some day. Do you mean whole ZB, including ZBF2L and ZBLL? I was going to do that, but it was a long time ago. I've realized that I'm just too lazy. I will learn some more algs to do 4b and OLL in one go in the future, but mastering intuitive parts first seems more important to me. It's nice to know that if I get stuck and my times aren't going down anymore, I can always just learn algs and get 1-2 seconds faster.

I've also started practicing Heise's method. I really like the idea to solve everything but 3 corners intuitively.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 6:57 pm 
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I can do that it just takes me a long time. I used it in this weeks FMC and got 31 moves, new record for me. most of the time you can fix the final corners intuitivly also. it's hard to explain how but I can do it sometimes. oh and as soon as I posted that last message I tryed the cube agiand and got 19.68. and then consistantly in the very low 20s, 23, 24. I'm definitly getting faster at the F2L and the whole cube in general. my most recent solve I messed up and had an edge fliped wrong in the 2x2x3 and I already had all the bad edges fliped. so I when back and fliped it and had to fix the bad edged all over agian. when I was finally done with the 2x2x3 I looked at the timer and it said 10 seconds. I got the rest of the F2L together pretty quickly and got my fasted alg for the PLL. my finall time was 25.57 seconds. pretty lucky to to go back and get this time.

here is a video. it's the first take.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJYtKXB5YA4

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 11:42 pm 
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Nice video, looks like you waited too long on PLL though.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 12:44 am 
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I just learned it yesterday. other than that the solve was very smooth.

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 11:16 am 
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Yea, nice video. F2L was really good. Just practice PLL for a while and your times will go down.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 7:15 pm 
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thanks. I remember when I used to take 30 to 35 seconds to do the F2L. good times. I learned another PLL today. I don't forget algs very often so they stick pretty good. I will now start learning to do them as fast as posible.

what are your times?

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 7:43 pm 
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I often practise doing all 21 PLL's in a row. I like it because it makes me practise every alg, also the ones I don't like. I'm trying to get that sub-40.

I average around 12 for F2L and 5-6 for LL so that's 17.xx for the whole cube usually. My best average is 14.99 though. :) I learned Petrus 13-14 months ago and since then I've practised it quite a lot. I'm not even getting close to the limits of this method yet, I'm pretty sure it can be faster than Fridrich. It's a nice goal to prove that 8-)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 7:58 pm 
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wow. how fast can you do the PLL step when solving?

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 8:07 pm 
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It depends on what case it is and is there need for AUF and/or cube rotation. Maybe 2-3 seconds on average. If I get something like T without AUF or cube rotation I can do it easily sub-1.5, but if I get E and need to AUF and lock up or something it can take like 4 seconds. Without any mistakes I can do every PLL sub-2. My DIY is really awesome.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 8:31 pm 
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I need DIY so bad. wal mart cubes are crap.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 8:51 pm 
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I have a nice 25th an. cube. one with white sticker not crappy silver. too annoying to look at. my cube is incredibly smooth for a toys are us cube. not as good as a DIY though.

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 9:04 pm 
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Those 25th an. cubes can be really good. At least the ones I used before I got some DIY's were really nice. The biggest difference is that I can adjust the looseness easily, but with 25th an. cube it isn't possible. If it gets too loose, there's nothing you can do.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 9:20 pm 
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Johannes91 wrote:
Those 25th an. cubes can be really good. At least the ones I used before I got some DIY's were really nice. The biggest difference is that I can adjust the looseness easily, but with 25th an. cube it isn't possible. If it gets too loose, there's nothing you can do.


Sure you can. You can take it apart and slap some paint on the inside and generally roughen it up a bit. That should slow it down for you. :wink: L8r.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 9:48 pm 
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my cube is just fine. my fastes number of moves I have ever gotten is 11.9. I did 24 moves in 2.01 seconds.

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 10:49 pm 
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Tim Browne wrote:
Sure you can. You can take it apart and slap some paint on the inside and generally roughen it up a bit. That should slow it down for you. :wink: L8r.


Sounds interesting. Too bad I didn't know that when I still used those cubes.

24 moves in 2 secs is quite fast. My record for that is 1.50 if I remember correctly. For 100 moves my best is around 6.5. I don't really like doing that for a minute, but I usually get around 700 moves when I try that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 11:04 pm 
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I have never bothered to try most moves per minute. it hurts. was solving pretty slow without timing my self and then I used the timer and got 17.78. the F2L was very fast and then the OLL was just a sune. th PLL was one of my fastest algs then I consistantly got 21s and 22s. getting faster...

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 11:18 pm 
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Yeah minute is too long. I've tried it just because I wanted to compare myself to others on speedcubing.com.

Wow, you are definately getting faster! One reason why I like cubing so much is that getting better requires just a lot of practice. Just solving it over and over again makes you faster...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2006 11:38 pm 
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I told all my friends I would be sub 20 by the end of the summer. I think it's coming. do you use the algs on dans site or something else. I know there are more than one alg to fix something because I use some from bondes site and some of them are comepletly different.

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 3:17 am 
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I've learned a lot from Katsu's site http://www.planet-puzzle.com/cubepll_evo.html

His cubing style is very similar to mine, so I really like all those algs. Basically they are long and either RUF or RUD type. I also use some from other sites, but most are taken from Katsu's site.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 4:47 am 
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same here


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:33 am 
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ok thanks. the one on bonbes site are very technical and use a lot of half turns. I will work on those. and I got third in tis weeks FMC.

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 11:08 am 
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yes. I can do an official 2 look LL with the fridrich algs. I know all of them left and right. there are two or 3 that I can't do very fast yet but learned them all very quickly.

_________________
Average: 14.38 seconds

Individual Times: 14.17, 12.93, (12.89), 13.12, 14.00, 15.59, 16.23, 14.11, 14.03, (17.61), 14.75, 14.89


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