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 Post subject: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:29 pm 
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So I have a nightmare cube and I have the worst time solving it. I usually take it apart and reassemble due to frustration. Is there a way to solve this if i can figure out the bandaging? I understand that there must be no blocking to make a turn, but is there a true solution for the bandaging? It has been a terrible experience to solve this. Any help is appreciated!

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:12 pm 
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NXTgen wrote:
So I have a nightmare cube and I have the worst time solving it. I usually take it apart and reassemble due to frustration. Is there a way to solve this if i can figure out the bandaging? I understand that there must be no blocking to make a turn, but is there a true solution for the bandaging? It has been a terrible experience to solve this. Any help is appreciated!


Sorry, can't help. I have the same experience. Just can't solve it, period. :oops:

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:34 pm 
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Would anyone else here have a possible solution? It's quite a challenge... Its a "Nightmare" some might say.

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:18 pm 
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I'd suggest mimicking the bandaging pattern on a 3x3, and only paying attention to the corners.

-Doug

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:58 am 
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Well, it depends on `what` the bandaging actually `is`. In the Museum the Nightmare cube is here:
http://twistypuzzles.com/cgi-bin/puzzle.cgi?pkey=3053
Museum wrote:
it was made from a 3x3x3 which was bandaged like the Bandaged Cube from Mefferts.
There has been some discussion here:
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=24452&start=19
As to what The Bandaged Cube actually `is` and it seems that it is functionally the same as the CT Bicube, which is `not` the original Bicube.
Attachment:
CT Bicube.jpg
CT Bicube.jpg [ 220.71 KiB | Viewed 3389 times ]
And I guess it depends on the puzzle you have, which might have an independant colour scheme, or depends on who it was made by, might be something else entirely:
When I first saw the pictures in the Museum (I edited them), I thought it looked like (what we might call a) `Fuse Clock` on the 333 Bandaged Cube thread: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=24452&start=0
Attachment:
Fuse Clock.jpg
Fuse Clock.jpg [ 666.04 KiB | Viewed 3390 times ]
Whatever variant you have, I can only imagine how difficult it must be (even with a solution- of which we have them all), but to know where the `clocked` edges are situated (clock hands are pointing) at any paritcular time, early in the solve, would be very difficult.

As for a solution: (Provided it's the `CT Bicube/ Meffert's Bandaged Cube` format) I would hesitate that you need to place the `armature of the puzzle` (all the pieces that are attached to the centres, and the one unbandaged corner) first. Then cycling the other (7 bandaged) corners with the sequences provided should be academic. The problem is that the armature will need to be placed by `feel` and perhaps some form of deductive mapping.

Good luck,
Burgo :)

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:48 am 
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Could I ask, is there a particular place/person to get hold of a Nightmare Cube from, or are they all individually made?

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:12 am 
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You've got to wonder whether there would be a market for Shapeways designed caps to temporarily stick onto the CT Bandaged 333 corners to make `many possible variants` of the Nightmare cube. Would that work? Or would there be an easier alternative?

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PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)


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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:27 am 
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I found this thread from four years ago: http://twistypuzzles.com/forum/viewtopi ... 15&t=11266
Member `Print to 3D` was not online for more than two years, though.
One of the Shapeways designers could investigate, what it would mean to make it available on the .stl file from Adam.

It would be less of a nightmare if Witeden could make it based on the transparent 2x2x2 with a bandaged and stickered `Bandaged Cube` inside.
(I have got one with a Fused Cube inside.)
Without seeing the internal 3x3x3 it must be incredibly hard.
Somebody should come forward, who can solve it :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:41 am 
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Hybrid424 wrote:
Could I ask, is there a particular place/person to get hold of a Nightmare Cube from, or are they all individually made?

I still have one cube left if someone's interested (out of 6 that I had made). Please see here: Nightmare Cube.

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:51 pm 
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I can redesign mine to do better, I still have the files, so I can make one for shapeways if anyone is interested. But I'll prototype it first this time.

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 6:08 pm 
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Yesterday I made a Nightmare Cube from a Mini Dian Sheng333 and a LanLan222.. it worked OK and I'm reasonably happy with the functionality of the puzzle.
Attachment:
Nightmare Cube.jpg
Nightmare Cube.jpg [ 703.34 KiB | Viewed 3222 times ]
This morning I sat down and made a solve. Let me say that `like other hidden internal bandaging` it is excruciating and I probably will never attempt it again. You need to deduce the bandaging or you are just flying in the dark. I won't bother with spoiler brackets because I discussed the `possible method` first in my previous post^^ and I'm only elaborating, so please accept the *spoiler* warning.

From a comletely scrambled cube: it is possible to map the internals, I did it with a diagram: I would suggest placing tiles on your CT bandaged cube as you make deductions (this was a minor revelation that came to me 1/2 way through- this works exactly the same as my diagram did, but it's visually easier). Let's work with what we know. We know the bandaging pattern and the colour scheme. The corners that are bandaged to edges allow us to know `the direction of the blocks (corners+attached edge)` by their colour.. that is the easy part. Place your corresponding tiles or mark them on your diagram.

Next, we know there are 4 edge-centre bonds and 1 centre-edge-centre.. we need to find the centre-edge-centre: To do it I found all of the edge-centres and deduced it. I needed to observe which face turn `moved the internal mechanism with it` on all 3 axis, for me 2 twisted and one was blocked. Where twists are possible there can't be bandaging; where the centre moves with a face ther must be bandaging `somewhere` in those layers. This gave me clues as to where some were, I found 2, I did a U' twist and deduced another and a U twist and deduced the 4th along with the corner-edge-corner block. You might want to temporarily use masking tape on your CT bandaged cube for this process.

Now I had to guess which way it was orientated. Once you decide what colour your `centre-edge blocks` are (using extrapolation of the RC colour scheme).. you can `lightly (temporarily)` place your tiles on your CT-B. Place your centre-edge blocks and mirror your twists (this is where the minor revelation hit me-because thinking my way through this was just excruciating- even though it's just a few twists). Your guess will lead you to 2 possibilities (let's call one `parity` for want of a better term): If you guessed wrong, when you place your centre-edge blocks, your `lone corner (red/white/blue for me)` will be incorrectly placed and orientated: you need to alter your colour scheme to the correct one and go again. Let me say that unless you are mirroring your moves on the CT-B now, your brain will be hurting :wink: .

Now that your internal mechanism is aligned, you can put away your CT-B and just follow your corner cycles for your preferred Mefferts Bicube method. I only used the CT-B as a moving diagram to map the internals, you don't need it here it would be unnessesary.

Cheers,
Burgo.

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1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)


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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 6:27 pm 
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Wow! You went through a lot to get that?? I thank you a lot! Now to try that on mine :)

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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 3:05 am 
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NXTgen wrote:
Wow! You went through a lot to get that??
:lol: Lucky I like puzzles.
And plus.. it's one more puzzle for the collection.. hold on a minute.. it's actually one less :o .. I better go buy another.

I thought I’d do another solve, with the mapping done entirely onto the CT Bandaged 333 this time, so I could add some pictures.. and it was much easier that way. We are fortunate enough to have that to make the mapping process so much easier. I can only imagine how difficult it would be to do the entire process in your head! On paper was difficult enough.

A picture is worth 1000 words so here we go [Click on any pictures to enlarge]:

Corner Mapping
Setting up your puzzle so that 2 or 3 axis are twistable in the first stage is recommended. The colour scheme dictates the direction of the 1x1x2 edge-corner blocks.
Attachment:
Corner Mapping.jpg
Corner Mapping.jpg [ 634.97 KiB | Viewed 3187 times ]

Centre Mapping
We do need to do some ½ twists (or more) to locate which face the internals twist with, to locate the 1x1x2 blocks and finally the centre-edge-centre block. I recommend temporarily putting masking tape on as you locate them. You can feel and see the mechanism obviously in most 222s anyway, but I don’t think I can in my Rubik’s brand.. so that would be a tougher one to map.
Attachment:
Centre Mapping.jpg
Centre Mapping.jpg [ 2.01 MiB | Viewed 3187 times ]

Parity Locate and Fix
Next we need to line up the armature of the puzzle (align the centre-edge blocks).This took literally 2 twists both times (before and after parity location), but I’m glad for the crutch using the CT-B, on paper or in your head it’s a `nightmare`. As you can see the `parity` is evidenced when the centres are aligned but the `lone corner` is incorrectly placed and orientated. You need to flip the centre-edge-centre colours and redo the other centre-edge colours accordingly, then realign the puzzle's armature. (As you can see: this is only 4 twists from the `starting state`, so all this mapping is for 4 -very important- twists.)
Attachment:
Parity locate and fix.jpg
Parity locate and fix.jpg [ 1.15 MiB | Viewed 3187 times ]

Solve with Bicube Method
We can put away the CT-B now, you don't need to map the solve.
Attachment:
Solve with Bicube Method.jpg
Solve with Bicube Method.jpg [ 2.06 MiB | Viewed 3187 times ]


As for the puzzle itself.. it’s a fantastic idea, but torturous in its present state, it’s cleverly designed to be almost unsolvable. In fact, if it were encountered `on the shelf` with no knowledge of its internal mechanism I can’t begin to imagine its difficulty level!

I’ve been looking into a few versions.. it would be nice with the following configurations (which can be sourced on the Bandaged cube thread linked to in my post above^^): Unbandaged Big Block (V1) this would be a nice achievable solve, Fuse Clock & Fuse-3, these would still be achievable but would test your metal (one has floating bandaging and one has centre-edge bandaging).. there are other suitable matches, but the advantage of these 3 is they are a very simple conversion from a standard 222 with a little glue.. and I believe, with practice, you could mentally picture the internal mechanisms.

Cheers,
Burgo.

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1st 3x3 solve Oct 2010 (Even though I lived through the 80s).
PB 3x3 55sec Jan 2011 (When I was a kid 1:30 was speedcubing so I'm stoked).
1st 3x3 Earth (nemesis) solve Jan 2011 My You Tube (Now has ALLCrazy 3X3 Planets with Reduction)


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 Post subject: Re: Nightmare cube solution?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 3:20 am 
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I have not looked into the details, but this frightens a bit. Burgo knows why :lol:

You'll get my vote for "Master of Bandaged Cubes"! :lol:

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