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 Post subject: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 12:33 am 
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INTRO: - I making a guide for 5x5 Rubik with pictures.. for other newbies like me that just loves playing rubik with our favourite pictures on iphone.

OBJECTIVE:- Can you share any good solution to re-arrange order of center pieces? I tried google but not much info.

ELLABORATION:- For standard 5x5 its easy, but with picture you need to solve in certain order to make it like a picture. IF you dun get what I mean. Look at cube below... pic of the lady (Nami) is all out of orientation & order?

[ImgPix]http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_6OGqJ2NQisA/TS_Zp6opriI/AAAAAAAAACI/4A_Gtw1RYgo/s1600/ctr2.PNG[/ImgPix]

I only have 1 method which I figured myself... very long & tedious.. especially if I end up with this. 2 piece of the lady (Nami) in the "middle lot" center piece is out of order.
[ImgPix]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6OGqJ2NQisA/TTA_Vo0K6SI/AAAAAAAAADw/__xsLlk9Zmg/s1600/nami1.jpg[/ImgPix]

I used 3 exchange method.. kinda of dumb :roll: actually but works for me so far. Matter of time... that is
http://picture5x5rubik.blogspot.com/p/step-3.html

PROBLEM STATEMENT:- cant solve if I am left with 2 "corner lot" center piece out of order. I can only solve if 2 "middle lot" center piece out of order. For 2 "corner lot" center piece, I re-arrange in a "zip & switch" (sorry for the vague explanation but detailed here http://picture5x5rubik.blogspot.com/p/step-2.html ) It takes time, try & error, and not systematic.... until I get it into a 2 "middle lot" center piece out of order. Like pic above Is there a parity here?

This is my first topic. Excuse me if I am not posting this right.[ImgPix][/ImgPix]


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 Post subject: Re: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 12:41 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 5:06 pm
Location: Berkeley, CA, USA
I found this blog article by Michael Gottlieb very useful:

http://michael-gottlieb.blogspot.com/20 ... cubes.html

I hope it can resolve your problem.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 1:01 am 
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Hi,

These are still just '3 exchange', or 3 cycle algorithms, but they should be faster, as they are moving centers on the same face.

For center corners here is a 3-cycle:

l' F l' U' r U l U' r' U F' l

This algorithm does this:
Attachment:
File comment: 1
5x5x5centcorner3cycle.png
5x5x5centcorner3cycle.png [ 134.53 KiB | Viewed 2081 times ]


For center edges here is a 3-cycle:

l' F l' U' M' U l U' M U F' l

This algorithm does this:
Attachment:
File comment: 2
5x5x5centedge3cycle.png
5x5x5centedge3cycle.png [ 134.29 KiB | Viewed 2081 times ]


Using these algorithms, you can solve the whole cube like a normal 5x5x5, and then permute the center pieces afterwards.

Also I didn't think it was possible to have just 2 center edges or just 2 center corners swapped, I may be wrong though.

I hope this helps!

-Mark- :)

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 Post subject: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:02 am 
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Already there was such theme. Here look:
http://twistypuzzles.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=235091#p235091


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 Post subject: Re: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:25 am 
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Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:37 pm
I found this video. This is part two. In the first part, he solved the center edge pieces; in this part, he solves corners in the centers. At 4:18, he uses r U' l' U r' U' l, which was explained earlier in the video, to cycle three corners in two different centers.

Door wrote:
Also I didn't think it was possible to have just 2 center edges or just 2 center corners swapped, I may be wrong though.

You may be right. In the video I linked to above, he does not show just two center corners unsolved.

Maybe you should take a closer look at your cube, wmchooi.


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 Post subject: Re: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:09 am 
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schuma,

Very informative site micheal has.. but no specifics in exactly how to solve left with 2 pcs parity on corner.

Another member on another rubik.com fwd to me earlier. Didn't work. I actually tried his suggested r U2 r U2 r U2 r U2 r . You can check it. its here http://picture5x5rubik.blogspot.com/p/discussion.html


Door,

You are right.. there are much shorter solutions to shift 3-pieces clockwise and anti-clockwise. But that two algorithms. That is not including the algorithm you used to solve the corner pieces first.

My idea is use only 3 simple algorithms to solve entire 5x5. It's for my frens.. I told them I can teach them only 3 algorithm to solve any 5x5 and 3x3. U know.. keep simple and stupid method? It's not for speed cubing obviously.

It actually works with standard 5x5. Only with Picture faces you'll get stuck if you end up with 2 pieces on corners. I only manage to solve if 2 pieces on middle or cross parity.



pytlivyj_1,

Thanks. If we end up with 3 pieces off.. means there is no parity. No problems. Many methods will work.



Zeotor,

At first I didn't believe it my self... but guys the parity is real & can happen. Odds are to hit on it is about 1/6. But somehow I got lucky.. manage to get myself into this parity after running the game 3 times. I not making this up.. I am play this on my iphone & saving this parity until I can solve it.

Ok... I have pasted snapshot exactly of what I have now on my iphone on the same discussion page above. Scroll down guys! It's real! I am not making it up. Just that chances are lower.
http://picture5x5rubik.blogspot.com/p/discussion.html

I tried another move suggested by another forum causing only parity shift.. initially it was on Nami the lady... not its only luffy.. the guys. You can check the cube with all my original pictures on the home page. Scroll down. I have all other center pieces correct. NO BLUFF.


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 Post subject: Re: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:02 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:16 pm
Location: Somewhere Else
If you need some practice with these, I'd suggest picking up the Eastsheen Super 5x5:

http://twistypuzzles.com/shop/index.php ... cts_id=153

The colored bars make it easy to practice. :)


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 Post subject: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 3:29 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2009 12:52 pm
The most simple and original decision of parities on a supercube 5x5x5: we do unique turn r (or r '). Then again we solve all hashed centres and edges already without parities!!! :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 7:37 pm 
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Location: Delft, the Netherlands
If you are solving a super 5x5x5 centres first, then you can indeed have two corner-centres swapped. You can solve it as the previous poster said, do an r or r' move and solve it again (with commutators, or sequences where any inner slice move is undone soon after).

Assuming the two corner-centres that need to be swapped are in the U face, a slightly more helpful method is doing r U2 r U2 r U2 r U2 r U2. This swaps two edge-centres in the U face. By doing a U move, you now have a situation that can be solved using only 3-cycles.

A hard to remember but otherwise easy method is to use the following move sequence:
r2 U r3 U r3 U3 r U r U2 r U2 r U r2 U r U3 r3 U3 r2 U r
This swaps the two corner-centres in the U face that lie at the front.
Note however that it also twists the U face centre. It is impossible to do such a swap without affecting the face centres as it requires an odd number of outer layer quarter turns.

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 Post subject: Re: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:03 pm 
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wmchooi wrote:
Ok... I have pasted snapshot exactly of what I have now on my iphone on the same discussion page above. Scroll down guys! It's real! I am not making it up. Just that chances are lower.
http://picture5x5rubik.blogspot.com/p/discussion.html

In the last image on that page, if you look closely at the face with Tony Tony Chopper on it and compare it to the one on this page, you can see that the center piece needs to be rotated 90 degrees counterclockwise.

So, I think what you need to do is put the Tony Tony Chopper face on the left and the Luffy face on top, rotating the U (Luffy) layer so that the two unsolved corners are in the front. Then, do what jaap posted followed by what is in the video description of this video. This gives you the following algorithm (which should solve the cube you linked to earlier):

r2 U r' U r' U' r U r U2 r U2 r U r2 U r U' r' U' r2 U r M E M' U' M E' M.


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 Post subject: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:59 am 
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2 jaap

I use by algorithm r U2 r U2 r U2 r U2 r U2 or (r U2)*5 very much for a long time (approximately 2 years). It is universal algorithm, about which I already wrote in the instruction "How to solve Siamese cubes". Look here: http://twistypuzzles.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=240916#p240916.


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 Post subject: Re: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:53 pm 
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Hi guys,

Sorry for late reply.. bz weekend.



Zeotor,

Thanx again for noticing my error on chopper. .. :shock: ..

Interesting our fren jaap, believes that two corner center piece can be swap... has some interesting algorithms


Jaap,

Thanx for the algorithms... been trying it. Like you said... it sort of affect center piece... and it is a 90 degree turn that we cannot correct without another face having 90 degree problem.

Parity here right? How to get that face facing the right way?? without help from other faces? I need unique turn like pytlivyj_1 say right? Which one do i need to touch?



pytlivyj_1,


I really think u must be correct about the unique turn.... just that I am lost which "unique" way should I turn?

For a center piece parity, I solve the disorder, break it into two faces, u or u' like this
http://picture5x5rubik.blogspot.com/p/step-4.html
Image


So which unique way should I go? I have try & error.. u or u' didn't work. Just screwed up another pair of center pieces between two other faces.. I not pick the correct "unique" turn. Can you tell me which way should I turn to solve say cube below?

Image

I dun really have the parity now on my cube.. I mistakenly tot I had it but Zeotor corrected me :oops: . When I had it last time... d / d' & u / u' doesn't work. But when I sort of re-scramble my cube & it work.


btw, (r U2)*5 was also given to me earlier by Zeotor , but it is simply swapping between 2 rows of corner center pieces... not only 2 corner piece. jaap solution was closer to what I was looking for.



Guys,

:idea: I have an idea... I think rather that keep on re-playing till I get the parity isn't very efficient... tiring... if we got right solution, we should be able to "invent" the parity right? I mean if we really can understand the parity.. like the parity on "middle" center pieces, I can actually create it back by introducing a single u' or u turn & solve.

If somebody here got an idea.. I think I'll just try to "reverse engineer" the corner center piece parity based on his solution. Should work right? I am getting bored re-playing 5x5.

Can anybody confirm whether this parity exist or I making a fool of myself?? :lol: anyway


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 Post subject: Re: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 11:37 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2011 3:38 pm
Why don't you solve the edges and corners first and then use the U2 BLD mehod for the centers which doesn't require any algorithms.


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 Post subject: Can you puzzle experts help on Picture rubik cube 5x5?
PostPosted: Sun Feb 27, 2011 2:25 pm 
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The cube 5х5х5 with very difficult figure of sides is easier for solving all so:

1. Correctly to solve 2 opposite centres. It is very easy;
2. To solve all edges. At the decision of parity we carry out algorithm so that already solved centres were not a side U;
3. Completely to solve a contour from corners and edges. The centres are desirable for arranging at once correctly;
4. To solve stayed 3 centres of an average zone it is consecutive one after another by algorithms:

(l' U 3r U') (l U 3r' U')........................................(3r U r U') (3r' U r' U')
Image Image

(3r U l' U') (3r' U l U')........................................(l' U r U') (l U r' U')
Image Image

(l' U' r U) (l U' r' U)
Image

***By similar algorithms we rearrange elements from a side D on a side U.
[For example: (3r2 U l2 U') (3r2 U l2 U')].


5. Last centre is soluble so:

Image

Good luck!


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