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 Post subject: Yet more computer help needed please
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:29 am 
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I can edit and post a video and I can make a Gif now but I still don't know some of the really basic stuff. For example, how do you post a link but instead of seeing and clicking on the actual address there's another word or words there? Scott Bedard has this set up for Rival Cubes on his posts.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:40 am 
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Type words here

Tony, like the above?

When posting, use the URL button - so it looks like this [url] but within the brackest have an '=' sign and then the address so it looks like this [ url = http://twistypuzzle] THEN TYPE WHAT YOU WANT TO SAY
(then you end the url tag) [/url]


you're going to have to delete the spaces (needed to add those to show you what's written.)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:45 am 
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thanks Reeeech

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:48 am 
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If you want to get really clever, put an IMG link inside the URL tags like:
[ url = http://twistypuzzles.com][ IMG ]http://twistypuzzles.com/large/00906-01.jpg[/img][/url]
And get a picture with a link.....
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@.=split(//,"J huhesartc kPaeenrro,lt");do{print$.[$_];$_=($_+3)%25;}while($_!=0);


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 12:00 pm 
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You're welcome Tony.

Haha yeah that'll work too Pembo :D 8-)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:20 pm 
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I miss HTML coding..I might go back into it :P

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Speedcubing tutorial

@.=split(//,"J huhesartc kPaeenrro,lt");do{print$.[$_];$_=($_+3)%25;}while($_!=0);


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:47 pm 
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Yea, I use HTML code for all my posts mainly because it's a bad habit to learn BB code, because it can vary from site to site. HTML code would look like this
Code:
<a href='www.website.com'>Hyperlink[/url]
<b>Bold</b>
<strong>Bold</b>
<i>Italics</i>
<em>Italics</em>
<u>Underline</u>
<s>Strike through</s>
[img]'www.website.com/picture.jpg' width='100px' height='200px'>


And for anyone who doesn't know the difference between and , and and ... The difference is that and will be emphasised on screen readers for the blind, whereas and will not.[/code]

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 3:53 pm 
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I loved computer science at school. Unfortunately it was a little different in the early 80s. I wish I had leant all this stuff.
BTW. I used to write programs in the BASIC language. Is there a way of using that language now? I miss being able to write and run simple programs. I am not looking to purchase software.
Thanks.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 4:29 pm 
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Tony, if your looking to write BASIC (beginners all-purpose symbolic instruction code), i dont recommend using what you used in the 80s. We've long improved on MSBASIC, GWBASIC, and the ever-popular QBASIC. I recommend using Visual Basic, it's pretty much the same as basic, but now you can add the visual apeal to your programs. Not to mention it is 100% more organized and powerfull then the 80's versions of BASIC. No more code that looks like this
Code:
10 REM Program Name
20 Color 4,14
30 CLS
40 Input "What is your name?", NAME$
50 Print "Hello " NAME$
60 END


Visual Basic uses "subs" to organize instead of numbering each line. It looks alittle something like this.

Code:
' Program Name
Public Sub form_load()
Input "What is your name?", NAME
End Sub

Public Sub cmdWelcome_Click()
MsgBox "Hello " & NAME
End Sub


And if your looking to learn a new language completely, i HIGHLY recommend C++. Not only is C++ (in my opinion) the best language right now, but it's syntax is almost identical to JAVA, PHP, Perl, C#, and many other languages that I am to lazy to think of right now. Point is, once you learn the syntax for one of these languages it is VERY easy to write in one of the other languages that shares it's syntax.

VB is alot easier to use. I have a copy of VB if you want it, contact me if your interested.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 5:02 pm 
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Scott Bedard wrote:
Code:
<a href='www.website.com'>Hyperlink[/url]
[img]'www.website.com/picture.jpg' width='100px' height='200px'>

[/code]


I believe the W3C spec has double-quotes instead of single quotes, although most browsers should interpret it correctly.

Also, trying to group C++ together with Perl and PHP seems to be a bit of a stretch. First, C++ is strictly typed and Perl and PHP are not. That makes a huge difference. Plus the concept of memory management.

A good beginner language would probably be Java, since a coding bug shouldn't crash the system.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 5:30 pm 
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when i associated C++, Perl, and PHP, i was mearly talking about the syntax.

example
Code:
function name($variable){
  if($variable == "foo"){
    echo "bar";
  }
}


Granted the functino names and commands are different, but the syntax for the most part is dead on.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 6:33 pm 
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Scott Bedard wrote:
Code:
<a href='www.website.com'>Hyperlink[/url]

That will most likely not work as intended.

Tony, what do you mean you're "not looking to purchase software"? Did you have to do that in those 80s? Today you can get pretty much everything for free, and I'm not talking about illegal stuff. I agree Java is a nice language to (re)start because it's fairly clean and has very good exception handling (tells you a lot about what went wrong when your program "crashes"). You can get everything you need from http://java.sun.com/.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 7:19 pm 
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Stefan, In many ways I am still a total novice with computers. In the 80s I was using school computers but as I recall if you bought a computer you simply switched it on and started programming in BASIC or loaded a disk. Things are so much better nowadays but I miss being able to produce lists/calculations etc. I just thought perhaps you had to purchase software to do it now. I know you can do stuff with Excel but understand it costs a lot. I hear bits of information here and there but it's not always easy to keep up with it all. I came into modern computing with no knowledge whatsoever. I only recently learnt what cut and paste was!!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2006 7:12 am 
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Tony Fisher wrote:
I miss being able to produce lists/calculations etc


Do you have a certain task in mind? Also, to find alternatives to Excel, one could do this:

- go to wikipedia.com and search for "excel"
- choose the excel you mean
- on the description page, let it tell you that excel is a spreadsheet program
- click on "spreadsheet"
- read the page, follow link "list of spreadsheets"
- read the page, give one or more of the many programs a try :D

Or go to google and search for "the best free spreadsheet" (include the quotes so it searches for the phrase, not the words separately). You'll likely find reviews or discussions. Hmm, people seem to like "Gnumeric".

Nowadays there's really free and even open source software for just about everything.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2006 8:43 am 
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Open Office[/url] has a fantastic spreadsheet that I occasionaly use.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 10, 2006 11:06 am 
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StefanPochmann wrote:

Tony, what do you mean you're "not looking to purchase software"? Did you have to do that in those 80s? Today you can get pretty much everything for free, and I'm not talking about illegal stuff. I agree Java is a nice language to (re)start because it's fairly clean and has very good exception handling (tells you a lot about what went wrong when your program "crashes"). You can get everything you need from http://java.sun.com/.



Tony,

Stefan is correct. Do you remember that site I sent you so you can download the .GIF program?

http://www.download.com/

It's a great site, and more than likely safe to download. So I would suggest Stefan's advice and find what you need exactly.... Then if you can't download that program from that site, Download.com will usually have it - mostly likely a freeware program (Free to download, but if you want the full version you may have to pay).

Cheers,
reeeech

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2006 10:02 pm 
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Thanks for the tips. I was hoping to be a bit lazy with this one. I would prefer to use my old BASIC language so I can spend the time writing the programmes I need instead of learning an entire new system. I know I've said in the past I want to learn as much as possible but if Scott's disk works out I can immediately get on with what I want to do. I am only interested in results generated by my progams so graphics and other stuff are not important.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2006 10:18 pm 
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Tony, im still yet to get to the post office, do you want me to include the original BASIC language install CD? The language is really outdated, but you might like it still.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2006 4:54 am 
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Stefan Pochmann wrote:
I agree Java is a nice language to (re)start


I take that back temporarily, learning Python right now and it looks good.

Tony, is there a specific task you have in mind for your programming adventures? Or is it just general interest?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2006 11:51 am 
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That would be good Scott. I'll give the Visual BASIC a go but having the original is still my preferred choice.
There's no one task I am trying to achieve Stefan, it's just something I miss having. It's like trying to find the square root of a number and realising you don't own a calculator anymore. I am sure one day I'll come back here asking about the more sophisticated stuff but all I need right now is something simple that I am familiar with.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2006 3:20 pm 
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Hi Tony :)

U can get the old QBasic from here The actual download is a bit down the page.

Then download and install DOSBOX which u can download here.

To get started in dosbox type intro and hit enter. Use the mount command to map the folder with the downloaded qbasic (olddos.exe). Go to this folder with old style dos-commands and type olddos.exe. This will unpack some files amongst them qbasic. Now type qbasic and u are ready to code good old basic 8-) (Yes the mouse will work!)

If u need more help with this please contact me! I have assumed that u are running windows. For qbasic in other OS-es i assume u just get DOSBOX for the appropriate OS, install it and do like described above :roll:

-Per :solved:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2006 3:34 pm 
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I think he is looking more for MSBasic or GW Basic, also I almost have MSVB on the net, it's 50%-ish uploaded.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2006 6:32 am 
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Hi :D

I would still recommend QBasic over other "DOS basic versions". But sure, that's not my choice what he wants to use :oops:

GW Basic, including manuals, tutorials, code samples etc can be downloaded here

With QBasic u will have an easier life if u want to compile ur programs later, for example with QuickBasic. And also u can create and edit subroutines in a nice way 8-)

Kind regards,

-Per :solved:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2006 11:11 am 
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:D

Why i need to sign up (for free) to read an article that discusses how much less accessible some computer stuff has become? That's both funny and annoying. Even here at this forum i don't have to login, unless i want to answer in a thread of course.

The link to read for free (no signing up) is not working and signing up is certainly not free either ... grrrrrrrrr ... :evil:

- Per :solved:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2006 3:13 pm 
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cuberoot wrote:


What an idiot. It's all out there, he's just too blind or ignorant to see it. And he shouldn't blame others just because his son is too stupid to adapt simple BASIC programs to C++. And what the [Censored. Please be nice!] is "line programming" anyway? Googles #1 result for it? Wikipedia article? Programming site? Nope. The article of that dumbo.

Per, click on "Enter Salon" at the end of the advertisement.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2006 8:19 pm 
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Hi :(

Either im too tired or too stupid. I find absolutely no way to read that darn article. I can read all the comments and blogs about it but not the article itself. Clicking on what im supposed to click i arrive at a dead link only ...

Grrrrr ... zzzz ...

-Per :scrambled:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 12:12 am 
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Some time ago I searched for something like Commodore or Apple BASIC. I will go with Liberty BASIC because of the nice website, forum, and a Dummies book available, but I haven't tried it out yet.

http://www.libertybasic.com/

I've just now found that Liberty BASIC has a free related software called Just BASIC.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just_BASIC

As for a common modern language, I'll add my vote for Python because it's often recommended and is free.

Responses to the Salon article I read included some unhelpful suggestions such as learning Flash or use Mathematica. BASIC was built in to the early home computers. Stuff like Flash programming requires software priced more than a hobbiest would want to pay. Mathematica would cost me more than the price of a new computer since I can't take advantage of discounts, not being a full time teacher or student. The hobbiest programmer today has to dig around and try to figure out what is good to play around with, and could easily just forget about the hassle.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 6:48 am 
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Per, do you have JavaScript turned on or off? Try it the other way.


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 Post subject: comp help
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 10:29 am 
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Stefan Pochmann wrote:
And what the [Censored. Please be nice!] is "line programming" anyway?


Line programming is what you would do to write a program in Basic in its original form. Each line of commands was numbered and all lines were used in sequence unless instructed to go to a particular line number, like "30 goto 15."

The original versions of Basis were translated line by line, instead of translating the whole thing in one go, and it was a lot easier to keep track of where you were in writing a program using line numbers.

Translating from Visual Basic to C++ is nothing like translating from the early versions of Basic to C++. The early versions of Basic were not object oriented.

Cheers,

DJ


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 10:58 am 
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perfredlund wrote:
:D

Why i need to sign up (for free) to read an article that discusses how much less accessible some computer stuff has become? That's both funny and annoying. Even here at this forum i don't have to login, unless i want to answer in a thread of course.

The link to read for free (no signing up) is not working and signing up is certainly not free either ... grrrrrrrrr ... :evil:

- Per :solved:


Just found a simple way to go around the problem...
the link ends with this:
basic/index_np.html
change that to:
basic/index.html

and you will find the article...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 12:21 pm 
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Stefan Pochmann wrote:
cuberoot wrote:


What an idiot. It's all out there, he's just too blind or ignorant to see it. And he shouldn't blame others just because his son is too stupid to adapt simple BASIC programs to C++.


Well, I can't do programming *i'm just learning by doing on things like fixing bugs in .php-files*, so don't take this comment too seriously, but I think he has a point.

Take these math textbook programming things, sure, his sone might not be very bright, since I had such things in my textbooks and I managed them easily on my calculator, but, I can say for sure, that without them I wouldn't be able to understand anything of what a php-script means. Well, as mentioned above, I can't program it, but I can still with only some dificulties find what is wrong...

And mind that he does point out that there is no real use for what he strive to learn his son, other than that it gives a better understanding on why a sertain line of programming does something...


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 12:59 pm 
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My point is that BASIC has *nothing* that more modern languages don't have. If you want to, you can code just as low-level in C++, Java, Python, etc as you can in BASIC.

Btw, those others are not really any more "high-level" than BASIC, they just offer a better syntax and a larger library.

What he's really after is the ability to copy code from a book into the computer without having to understand it. And that shall be a good thing?


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 2:23 pm 
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Stefan Pochmann wrote:
My point is that BASIC has *nothing* that more modern languages don't have. If you want to, you can code just as low-level in C++, Java, Python, etc as you can in BASIC.

Btw, those others are not really any more "high-level" than BASIC, they just offer a better syntax and a larger library.


Okey, didn't know that, but I guess that he meant better syntax etc. when he said higher level...

Stefan Pochmann wrote:
What he's really after is the ability to copy code from a book into the computer without having to understand it. And that shall be a good thing?


Ehh, at least not from that point of view...
Jeech, I got a lot to learn :P
But I can say that I did rather well in understanding when transferring to my calculator, so to my opinion, you take it one step to far in criticising...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 4:59 pm 
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Haara wrote:
Okey, didn't know that, but I guess that he meant better syntax etc. when he said higher level...


Unlikely. And even if, that would make no sense. Bad syntax doesn't help understand the computer any more than good syntax.

Quote:
But I can say that I did rather well in understanding when transferring to my calculator, so to my opinion, you take it one step to far in criticising...


I didn't criticize you, did I? Only that guy.

He's clearly not after a language that has all the properties of BASIC. He's solely after BASIC. My only explanation for this still stays: he wants to be able to copy code exactly and not have to understand what the code does. Which would probably be very easy, particularly in case of math textbook code examples.

Plus, simply googling for "basic interpreter" shows this as result #1. What's his problem??? (besides his incompetence)
http://www.thefreecountry.com/compilers/basic.shtml


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:47 pm 
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Stefan Pochmann wrote:
Haara wrote:
]But I can say that I did rather well in understanding when transferring to my calculator, so to my opinion, you take it one step to far in criticising...


I didn't criticize you, did I? Only that guy.


No, you didn't criticize me, it was just that I meant to say that if I could grasp what I did, then why can't anyone else...
Because of that I meant that you might use some ho harch words towards him, not me...
But as I pointed out earlier, I don't do this at any scale worth mentioning, so don't mind it all that much...


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 6:11 pm 
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Mystery resolved :D

For some weird reason the flash content (Flash 8) did not show in IE, it displayed page not found. Worked fine in FF. And so finally could read the stupid article ... hehe ... :wink:

-Per :solved:

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2006 7:52 pm 
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Btw, I used assembler and Basic intensely for several years, because I sadly was too lazy to learn better languages. So I kinda know what Basic is. And it did *not* teach me how computers work. Assembler did.

Among other things I wrote a music player, movie player and 3D graphic engine in assembler. Not using any external libraries (except bios and dos which don't give you much besides fundamental access to hard disks and that kind of stuff), I computed and drew every single pixel myself and the equivalent for the music player. Doing these things I did learn a lot about how the computer works, particularly about its components and how they interact. But it was assembler. Not Basic. Basic doesn't teach you anymore about computers than C and others. Probably less.

I also know that line numbers thing. That however is no good thing at all and it doesn't help understand the computer the tiniest bit (in assembler with memory addresses it does). I believe it was simply a result of computers being very weak back then. Fullscreen editors with scrolling? Mice? Ha!

That article does more harm than good.


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