Online since 2002. Over 3300 puzzles, 2600 worldwide members, and 270,000 messages.

TwistyPuzzles.com Forum

It is currently Sat Apr 19, 2014 11:18 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:05 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 1:50 pm
Location: Near Las Vegas, NV
Hey guys,
After over 7 months of development I am FINALLY ready to present:
Superchop Tetrahedron
The first triple (fully) deep-cut twisty puzzle.
VIDEO PROOF
Attachment:
DSC00292.JPG
DSC00292.JPG [ 1.69 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

Attachment:
DSC00293.JPG
DSC00293.JPG [ 1.43 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

The Superchop Tetrahedron is the first twisty puzzle that is deep-cut on all axis systems. That is, given the three axis systems of a solid, it turns on the faces, vertices, and edges (making it a complete hybrid) where all of those turns are deep turns:
Attachment:
DSC00294.JPG
DSC00294.JPG [ 1.52 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

Attachment:
DSC00295.JPG
DSC00295.JPG [ 1.55 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

Attachment:
DSC00296.JPG
DSC00296.JPG [ 1.38 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

I normally don't present unfinished puzzles, but I've been working on this for so long that I thought I should get it out there.

A bit of background:

There are certain types of twisty puzzles called deep-cut puzzles, which have flat cuts that cross the origin. Often, they are one of the hardest types of puzzles to design. There are several classes of them as well. There are the single deep-cut puzzles, which use only one type of axis system, and have been made before (face, corner, or edge turning). Double deep-cut puzzles utilize 2 deep-cut axis systems instead of one (face and corner, face and edge, or edge and corner turning) and have also been made before. Finally, there is a third type, called a triple deep-cut puzzle, which utilizes all 3 types of axis systems (face, corner, and edge turning) which has never been made until now. Such puzzles are called "super chops" hence the name Superchop Tetrahedron.

Some stats:

The puzzle contains over 200 parts, of which only 32 of them are visible.
There are 17 unique piece types in total, but only 5 of them are on the outer puzzle.
The edge length is 100mm, making it slightly larger than a mass-produced Pyraminx.

As you might have guessed, this puzzle can shapeshift, but in many bizarre ways. For example, not only can you make multiple 90 degree edge turns, like in a Pyramorphix:
Attachment:
DSC00297.JPG
DSC00297.JPG [ 1.53 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

Attachment:
DSC00298.JPG
DSC00298.JPG [ 1.52 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

You can also make corner or face turns in the middle of these edge turns:
Attachment:
DSC00299.JPG
DSC00299.JPG [ 1.53 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

Attachment:
DSC00300.JPG
DSC00300.JPG [ 1.54 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

All scrambled up for your pleasure:
Attachment:
DSC00302.JPG
DSC00302.JPG [ 1.41 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

Attachment:
DSC00303.JPG
DSC00303.JPG [ 1.42 MiB | Viewed 2791 times ]

It has taken me about 5 months alone just to figure out a mechanism for this puzzle that would work (I started this project in February 2013). The puzzle isn't perfect though. It turns very smoothly, but the issues are mainly due to very tiny pieces inside, which often jump out of place and cause fatal misalignment problems. Luckily, I know how to make those pieces larger (hopefully enough to be stable) and I will be presenting V2 of this puzzle eventually.
For now, I hope you enjoy!

_________________
My Youtube channel
My Shapeways Shop


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:29 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:54 pm
Location: Bay Area, California
Really cool. Can you comment on how your puzzle differs from the Skewb + 2x2x2? That is, Gelatinbrain's 3.4.1 puzzle?

Is there ever a time where some edge or some vertext turns are blocked?

_________________
Prior to using my real name I posted under the account named bmenrigh.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:52 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2000 2:51 am
Location: New Ulm, Minnesota, USA
Awesome puzzle. Don't you think the 3rd and the 4th picture are the same in turning? Here's a example. If just turn only face part of a Pyraminx you could in fact call face turning and corner turning at the same time like you have there. If the second layer would turn that would be cool and then I'd agree.

http://twistypuzzles.com/cgi-bin/puzzle.cgi?pkey=540

_________________
Darren & Traiphum's Dual Helicoptrahedron
X-TownCuber wrote:
Are my eyes deceiving me, or is this the coolest puzzle ever?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:50 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 8:38 pm
Location: Russia
Great Puzzle!!! Congratulation
this is same as: Skewb + 2x2x2... see my version
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCx52fcAY0o

_________________
my Shop: ShapeWays, grigorusha Big Puzzle Sale: EBay
Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 4:55 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 1:13 am
Location: Saint-Petersburg, Russia
Perfect!

See my post about SuperZ (2x2 + Skewb).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 6:27 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 1:47 am
Location: near Utrecht, Netherlands
I think Grigr and Vladimir are correct about this being a Skewb+2x2, but in that case they should give credit to Adam Cowan for being the first to make one (and a fully mechanical, not magnetic version, at that!).

_________________
Tom's Shapeways Puzzle Shop - your order from my shop includes free stickers!
Tom's Puzzle Website


Buy my mass produced puzzles at Mefferts:
- 4x4x6 Cuboid for just $38
- Curvy Copter for just $18
- 3x4x5 Cuboid for just $34


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 6:44 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 1:13 am
Location: Saint-Petersburg, Russia
Sure, mechanical version of Adam Cowan is nice and more meaningful than magnetic one.

BTW, is there video of Skewb+2x2 by Adam Cowan? I checked that post, his Shapeways
page and video channel, but haven't found. How does it turn?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:50 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 1:50 pm
Location: Near Las Vegas, NV
Darren Grewe wrote:
Awesome puzzle. Don't you think the 3rd and the 4th picture are the same in turning? Here's a example. If just turn only face part of a Pyraminx you could in fact call face turning and corner turning at the same time like you have there. If the second layer would turn that would be cool and then I'd agree.

http://twistypuzzles.com/cgi-bin/puzzle.cgi?pkey=540

Mecahnically speaking, I really don't think they are the same thing. This puzzle is bandaged on the inside, which means that some turns will move the core. So, if one does a normal face turn, the opposite vertex turn will be moving the core, and I like to think of puzzles turning where the core remains stationary. There are some internal center pieces that correspond to face turns, and others to vertex turns, so this puzzle really turns in 2 different ways.
bmenrigh wrote:
Is there ever a time where some edge or some vertext turns are blocked?

No: face, corner, and edge turns are always allowed. I could have used TomZ's Offset Skewb+2x2 mechanism for this puzzle, but those turns would have been blocked, so it wouldn't have been a true triple deep-cut puzzle.

_________________
My Youtube channel
My Shapeways Shop


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:33 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2010 11:12 am
Location: Hong Kong/Beijing
Very complicated yet gorgeous puzzle!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:52 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 7:03 am
Location: Koblenz, Germany
About the Super Z:
http://twistypuzzles.com/cgi-bin/puzzle.cgi?pkey=3270

Ben: A great achievement.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 9:24 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 12:09 pm
Location: Missouri
TomZ wrote:
I think Grigr and Vladimir are correct about this being a Skewb+2x2, but in that case they should give credit to Adam Cowan for being the first to make one (and a fully mechanical, not magnetic version, at that!).
Tom, you had your own design for a Skewb+2x2x2...
TomZ wrote:
Yes, I've had a proper mechanical implementation in the works for a while. It's currently being printed.
How did this turn out? I don't recall ever seeing the finished puzzle presented.

Nice looking puzzle benpuzzles. Your use of the term Superchop is new to me. I'm familiar with Little Chop and Big Chop which are the deep cut edge turning cube and dodecahedron respectively. Has Superchop been used in the context before or are you defining it now?

Carl

_________________
-
Image

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 2:55 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:21 pm
Location: Marin, CA
First, I love this! It's great.

Second, regarding the Skew-By-Two,
Yeah, Adam designed two versions a few years (?) ago which I printed and assembled. The V2 moves very nicely. I've taken photos and video as well, and sent them to Adam, but he has never posted about it. I'll see if I can get him to do that, or give me permission to post the existing photos and video.

_________________
Jason Smith posted here as 'io' through 2012.
Visit Jason Smith's PuzzleForge on Shapeways!
Jason Smith's Puzzles - YouTube Channel.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 3:01 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 1:50 pm
Location: Near Las Vegas, NV
wwwmwww wrote:
Your use of the term Superchop is new to me. I'm familiar with Little Chop and Big Chop which are the deep cut edge turning cube and dodecahedron respectively. Has Superchop been used in the context before or are you defining it now?

Carl

The term "super chop" was used in the simulator MagicTile.

_________________
My Youtube channel
My Shapeways Shop


Last edited by benpuzzles on Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 8:33 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:26 pm
Location: Saratoga Springs, NY
JasonSmith wrote:
Yeah, Adam designed two versions a few years (?) ago which I printed and assembled. The V2 moves very nicely. I've taken photos and video as well, and sent them to Adam, but he has never posted about it. I'll see if I can get him to do that, or give me permission to post the existing photos and video.


Well, it was either hijacking this thread, or an epic bump of the original thread, so I chose the latter. Enjoy the pics and video!

_________________
I will not Reason and Compare: my business is to Create. -William Blake

Videos on Youtube!

New Designs on Shapeways!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 5:41 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 1:50 pm
Location: Near Las Vegas, NV
For reference, here are some pictures of the small parts that cause the issues in the puzzle:
Attachment:
DSC00308.JPG
DSC00308.JPG [ 1.63 MiB | Viewed 2254 times ]

Attachment:
DSC00309.JPG
DSC00309.JPG [ 1.97 MiB | Viewed 2254 times ]

Actually, there is another type of piece in the puzzle that is SMALLER than this. It doesn't cause issues with the turning though.

_________________
My Youtube channel
My Shapeways Shop


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:27 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:21 pm
Location: Marin, CA
Yeah, those small pieces can kill you. What I hate is how big they can look in Solidworks. It can be very deceptive.
I'm getting to a point where I have numbers I try not to compromise for layer thickness, fillets, etc.
Again, this is a very cool achievement!

_________________
Jason Smith posted here as 'io' through 2012.
Visit Jason Smith's PuzzleForge on Shapeways!
Jason Smith's Puzzles - YouTube Channel.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:17 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 1:50 pm
Location: Near Las Vegas, NV
JasonSmith wrote:
Yeah, those small pieces can kill you. What I hate is how big they can look in Solidworks. It can be very deceptive.

Exactly! If I knew they were going to be this small, I would have adjusted the cut depth appropriately. The good thing is that I know what I need to do for V2 to make it better.

_________________
My Youtube channel
My Shapeways Shop


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 2:19 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2012 10:01 am
If I understand correctly, you're defining "superchop" as a puzzle which has deep cuts on vertex turns, edge turns, and face turns? If that's the case this will probably be the only superchop puzzle;

Superchop Cube: 2x2x2 + Skewb + Little Chop
Superchop Octahedron: Shape mod of Superchop Cube
Superchop Dodecahedron: Pentultimate + Chopasaurus + Big Chop
Superchop Icosahedron: Shape mod of Superchop Dodecahedron


I doubt we'll ever see any of those puzzles, at least in the near future we won't.

_________________
My YouTube, including a FF Siamese 2x2x2 Walkthrough


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: The Superchop Tetrahedron: An Ultimate Deep-cut Puzzle
PostPosted: Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:47 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 1:50 pm
Location: Near Las Vegas, NV
JackRTully wrote:
If I understand correctly, you're defining "superchop" as a puzzle which has deep cuts on vertex turns, edge turns, and face turns? If that's the case this will probably be the only superchop puzzle;

Superchop Cube: 2x2x2 + Skewb + Little Chop
Superchop Octahedron: Shape mod of Superchop Cube
Superchop Dodecahedron: Pentultimate + Chopasaurus + Big Chop
Superchop Icosahedron: Shape mod of Superchop Dodecahedron


I doubt we'll ever see any of those puzzles, at least in the near future we won't.

Yes, that's correct. It might be possible to make the Superchop cube/octahedron with the staples approach, but I honestly doubt it.

_________________
My Youtube channel
My Shapeways Shop


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

Forum powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group