Hi all,

MF8 has finished the production process for the mass produced pentagram! They have given me the go ahead to announce it so I thought I would share a picture and video. I do not know any details on the price but I do know it will available for purchase at some point later this year.

Cheers!

Youtube Video

Congratulations! You've gone WAY too long without any of your fantastic designs being mass produced. I can't believe how long this took them. If every puzzle takes them this long from start to finish they must have 50 different puzzles in the pipeline at a time.

Have you taken it apart to see how close it is to your original design? Obviously it's a lot bigger but how similar are the cut depths for the internal shells?

Do you know where this would fall in terms of difficulty, compared to current mass productions? Looks like a must own piece to me.

Good to know the news. I have always wanted this Pentagram to be mass-produced!

TheCubingKyle wrote:Do you know where this would fall in terms of difficulty, compared to current mass productions? Looks like a must own piece to me.

It's the same as the Bauhinia, but with corners instead of edges. I definitely prefer the look of the straight cuts on this though. I'd be surprised if the mechanism isn't based strongly on the Bauhinia. Nice to see another Corner turning Dodecahedron, and a big congratulations Eric!

Congratulations Eric
I'll order one for sure.

It's actually the dodecahedral equivalent to Eitan's star. I'd guess that they have the same guts

very very good!

It is wonderful news that this interesting and great-looking puzzle is being mass produced and that the Bauhinia is getting a sibling!

Very Nice. Unfortunately I guess some sensitive folks might not buy because of the name.

Wow! MF8 is really taking over the puzzle market (by far in my eyes). Way to produce puzzles that normally wouldn't be available! Go MF8!

#sosickofcuboids

Congrats Eric!

Chris

Great news Eric!

Dave

Thinking about it some more, is the face pattern a pentagram inscribed withing a pentagon inscribed withing a second pentagon? Alternately, is the face pattern the same a a megaminx/pentultimate hybrid?

Jeffery Mewtamer wrote:Thinking about it some more, is the face pattern a pentagram inscribed withing a pentagon inscribed withing a second pentagon? Alternately, is the face pattern the same a a megaminx/pentultimate hybrid?

Yes it's the same as Gelatinbrain's 1.1.8 (Megaminx + Pentultimate).

The Megaminx + Pentultimate description only works if the Megaminx cut depth is down to exactly the midpoint of the edges on the dodecahedron. If you have a shallow Megaminx + Pentultimate you end up with Gelatinbrain's 1.1.19 which is a completely different puzzle.

Tony Fisher wrote:Very Nice. Unfortunately I guess some sensitive folks might not buy because of the name.

i don't see the name being a problem. granted, we here in the United States might have an easier time solving a Pentapound, but we try to be open-minded about these things.

Tony Fisher wrote:Very Nice. Unfortunately I guess some sensitive folks might not buy because of the name.

I suppose that makes everyone else insensitive...

Ever since this puzzle was shown the name has gotten me wondering. Though I know a Pentagram is [bordering fine line here with the topic, edit where needed] strongly associated with religious views both positive and negative, the name would only be fully accurate assuming the star was circumscribed about a circle. A spherical version of this would be more connected to a pentagram than a dodecahedral version.

Now, seeing as it could cause problems in marketing, I'm sure MF8 will have an alternative name for the puzzle, though not sure what it would be. It's a great puzzle, but general audiences already commonly comment on a megaminx having a "pentagram" on it -while it's not it shares that view from person to person I've encountered- it would definitely be more difficult to makret with "pentagram" in the name.

So, since it was unveiled as a shapeways puzzle, and now recently being produced by MF8, I still wonder if a renaming would be the better choice, or to leave it and let people buy it as they feel acceptable.

The name doesn't offend me [not trying to delve into that] but for others it may... Eric, what's your take on the naming portion?

-Chris

NXTgen wrote:Ever since this puzzle was shown the name has gotten me wondering. Though I know a Pentagram is [bordering fine line here with the topic, edit where needed] strongly associated with religious views both positive and negative, the name would only be fully accurate assuming the star was circumscribed about a circle. A spherical version of this would be more connected to a pentagram than a dodecahedral version.

Now, seeing as it could cause problems in marketing, I'm sure MF8 will have an alternative name for the puzzle, though not sure what it would be. It's a great puzzle, but general audiences already commonly comment on a megaminx having a "pentagram" on it -while it's not it shares that view from person to person I've encountered- it would definitely be more difficult to makret with "pentagram" in the name.

So, since it was unveiled as a shapeways puzzle, and now recently being produced by MF8, I still wonder if a renaming would be the better choice, or to leave it and let people buy it as they feel acceptable.

The name doesn't offend me [not trying to delve into that] but for others it may... Eric, what's your take on the naming portion?

-Chris

a pentagram is just a five-pointed star, typically drawn with lines of equal length. there's no circle around it.

what you're thinking of is a pentacle, which is a pentagram (or other star shape) used on some sort of religious token, often with some artistic elaboration like the surrounding circle, or funky inscriptions in Celestial script, or whoknowswhat. unfortunately for geometers, the names are often used interchangeably.
 

crypticat wrote:

NXTgen wrote:Ever since this puzzle was shown the name has gotten me wondering. Though I know a Pentagram is [bordering fine line here with the topic, edit where needed] strongly associated with religious views both positive and negative, the name would only be fully accurate assuming the star was circumscribed about a circle. A spherical version of this would be more connected to a pentagram than a dodecahedral version.

Now, seeing as it could cause problems in marketing, I'm sure MF8 will have an alternative name for the puzzle, though not sure what it would be. It's a great puzzle, but general audiences already commonly comment on a megaminx having a "pentagram" on it -while it's not it shares that view from person to person I've encountered- it would definitely be more difficult to makret with "pentagram" in the name.

So, since it was unveiled as a shapeways puzzle, and now recently being produced by MF8, I still wonder if a renaming would be the better choice, or to leave it and let people buy it as they feel acceptable.

The name doesn't offend me [not trying to delve into that] but for others it may... Eric, what's your take on the naming portion?

-Chris

a pentagram is just a five-pointed star, typically drawn with lines of equal length. there's no circle around it.

what you're thinking of is a pentacle, which is a pentagram (or other star shape) used on some sort of religious token, often with some artistic elaboration like the surrounding circle, or funky inscriptions in Celestial script, or whoknowswhat. unfortunately for geometers, the names are often used interchangeably.
 

This might be a language issue. Your text is interesting and I don't mind the name at all, but if I am correct, then in german it is infact called Pentagram. Maybe even the german term Pentagram is only slang though, I am not sure.
However there might be more european languages where Pentagram is the translation for pentacle.

alaskajoe wrote:

crypticat wrote:

NXTgen wrote:Ever since this puzzle was shown the name has gotten me wondering. Though I know a Pentagram is [bordering fine line here with the topic, edit where needed] strongly associated with religious views both positive and negative, the name would only be fully accurate assuming the star was circumscribed about a circle. A spherical version of this would be more connected to a pentagram than a dodecahedral version.

Now, seeing as it could cause problems in marketing, I'm sure MF8 will have an alternative name for the puzzle, though not sure what it would be. It's a great puzzle, but general audiences already commonly comment on a megaminx having a "pentagram" on it -while it's not it shares that view from person to person I've encountered- it would definitely be more difficult to makret with "pentagram" in the name.

So, since it was unveiled as a shapeways puzzle, and now recently being produced by MF8, I still wonder if a renaming would be the better choice, or to leave it and let people buy it as they feel acceptable.

The name doesn't offend me [not trying to delve into that] but for others it may... Eric, what's your take on the naming portion?

-Chris

a pentagram is just a five-pointed star, typically drawn with lines of equal length. there's no circle around it.

what you're thinking of is a pentacle, which is a pentagram (or other star shape) used on some sort of religious token, often with some artistic elaboration like the surrounding circle, or funky inscriptions in Celestial script, or whoknowswhat. unfortunately for geometers, the names are often used interchangeably.
 

This might be a language issue. Your text is interesting and I don't mind the name at all, but if I am correct, then in german it is infact called Pentagram. Maybe even the german term Pentagram is only slang though, I am not sure.
However there might be more european languages where Pentagram is the translation for pentacle.

it's not really a language issue. 'pentagram', in any language, comes from a Greek word that literally means '[a thing made of] five lines', and is nothing more than a name for a five-pointed star.
but people's connotation of this symbol, based on its historical religious use, is quite another thing.
 

Exactly:

Well, I learned something today. Didn't mean to derail the thread like that, but I did learn.

Thanks everyone on the clarification. I had only seen it depicted in a circle, never a star alone and I haven't seen any regional/language differences as I only know English (didn't look at wikipedia either).

But back on topic; when the puzzle is available do you think the price will be in the 40-45 USD range? Seeing it's very similar to the Bauhinia I'm sure the mechanism was modified to be that of the Bauhinia, so I'd guess the price in that range would be about right. That and I'm curious of the size difference of the shapeways version compared to this version.
Could we get a picture side by side?

Since the puzzle is mechanically equivalent to Eitan's Star I wouldn't expect anything lower than $99...

I still don't have Eitan's Star and I doubt I'll be able to afford this any time soon, either.

we had 7 mf8 dodecahedrons to know more or less the price of them, the pentagram will be 42 $ as most of them. If mf8 releases another icosahedron it will be 99$, that is my two cents (pun city).

Who's had them apart and made a comparison? Is the `actual` mechanism shared between Eitan's Star and the Bauhinia?.. I wouldn't think so with the price difference, but then I don't see why they'd change it either. Eitan's Star seems physically `bigger`, but I'm not sure if it's just because of the different shape. The Bauhinia mechanism seems to be able to cope with the Pentagram because it has the unseen corner pieces there. And the puzzle in Eric's video seems more in line with the size of all the MF8 dodecahedrons in the group. It's possible that the puzzle will be in line with the price of the Dodecahedrons.. I hope so.

Congratulations Eric! I cannot wait to hold this beauty in my hands
A true must-have

Any ETA on when it'll be listed for sale at various shops?

Man, I have not checked back here in a while! I've wanted this ever since Vergo showed off his shapeways version. Mass-produced... Yes... Yes... *cackles*

I'm thinking if the mechanism is shallower than Eitan's Star, I could have a second chance at making a cubic version... Hm...

Congrats Eric. This is definitely on my to buy list. Looks great.

Congrats Eric on the mass production, it looks fantastic.

Anyone offended by the name is seriously overly sensitive. If the puzzle came stickered with a goat's head inscribed in the pentagram, then maybe I'd understand.

I had the opportunity to turn a copy given to Eric and I'm quite surprised at how well it turns. It's better (smoother) than some of the other recent MF8 dodecahedrons.

This puzzle is now avalible for preorder at HK-nowstore.

It says

MF8 and Eric Vergo Pentagram Original Plastic Body (Limited Edition)

which looks like a dirty white to me.

It seems to be the standard color of the original white plastics; milky. It is quite pretty actually and smooth as well, I have a speedcube in that color

But:

Kattenvriendin wrote:It seems to be the standard color of the original white plastics; milky. It is quite pretty actually and smooth as well, I have a speedcube in that color

i've been curious about this phenomenon for some time, and have heard it from others on this forum and elsewhere...

i have four or five puzzles made with this undyed (milky white) plastic, which i've been able to compare to their dyed cousins, and the undyed puzzles all have smoother rotation.   also, the undyed plastic seems somehow more resilient, though i've never tested this.
i don't believe these are illusions based on preconceived notions. however, given the very small sample number, it's possible that each one is a fluke of some sort, and on the whole, there is no difference.

is there any scientific support for these observations?
 

Glad to see it's priced like the Bauhinia and not Eitans star.

I think the milky plastic is used for mold testing because it scars when stressed and is semi-transparent which shows cracks and weak points better. It's also softer and easier to cut and scratch which I suspect is useful for trimming the plastic when they're still trying to figure out what changes need to be made for the molds.

The black production ABS is definitely more brittle. I doubt it's the dye that makes it more brittle, it's probably a different formulation of ABS (my guess would be that it's cheaper in bulk).

I'm hoping it comes with the same color scheme as the other mf8 dodecahedrons. I've been noticing a disturbing loss of of the beautiful dark purple and the golden yellow in recent puzzles.

There are a lot of people in the speedcubing community who say it's faster. There are a lot of people in the speedcubing community who say it's not.

I don't think it's actually been put to a real test, so.. it's undecided for as far as I know.

Brandon Enright wrote:I think the milky plastic is used for mold testing because it scars when stressed and is semi-transparent which shows cracks and weak points better. It's also softer and easier to cut and scratch which I suspect is useful for trimming the plastic when they're still trying to figure out what changes need to be made for the molds.

The black production ABS is definitely more brittle. I doubt it's the dye that makes it more brittle, it's probably a different formulation of ABS (my guess would be that it's cheaper in bulk).

useful information — thank you! now finally my research has a solid starting point.
 

Would you happen to know if this puzzle is going to come in black at all? If it is how many are they going to make?

Black is available to pre-order with hknowstore and champion cube store!

I just received my (milky white) Pentagram and my first thoughts are mixed. It turns very well... hmmm.. when the corners don't catch. I think that the corners are a bit bigger than necessary - if their corners were rounder the turning would be great. Other issue is the quality of the 3-part corners - there are clearly visible gaps between the parts.
I'm affraid that the solving experience will be somewhat comparable to the void master pentultimate, covering the entire range between "I love it" and "I hate it".

What's the color scheme - can you post pics of each hemisphere compared to a standard mf8 dodecahedron?

hello
Pictures from champion cube store

Yeah I saw those but sometimes the actual puzzle you get is different than the pre-order images. So the purple in the hemisphere with the black face is a very light color and the golden yellow is more of a fluorescent yellow. What a shame. OK thanks for posting the images.

I haven't stickered mine yet but here are the colors (altered by my phone's camera):



I'm not sure, but it seems to me that the colors are different from the other MF8 dodecahedra I have (Bauhinia, Curvy Starminx, VMP).

I ordered one like this from hknowstore. mine hasn't arrived yet. Looking forward to it. Have you tried silicon spray yet?

Anyone had an update on their Black Body orders? My sister preordered it Dec 14th for my Christmas present. HKnowstore has it listed as in-stock, but her order has not updated at all.